-
Hi Guest - Sign up now for Secret Santa 2024!
Click here to sign up! -
Hi Guest - Come check out all of the new CP Merch Shop! Now you can support CigarPass buy purchasing hats, apparel, and more...
Click here to visit! here...
My thoughts on Passes
- Thread starter cohibasurfer
- Start date
I'd like to comment on the praise posting in pass threads.
I agree and disagree. I agree that posting a positive "Nice Play" just for the sake of post padding is a bad thing IF THE PLAY WAS INFACT BAD, but I strongly support the players of a pass to encourage and support the play of other passers. As a pass originator and a player- I enjoy reading the comments made by the others, and I think more so as a player, I like to see and read the support from my piers and fellow passers to reassure me that my play was fair.
Not everyone here (myself included of course) are cigar experts or retailers... So knowing EVERYTHING is simply not possible, and it helps to have others involved in the pass chime in and let you know what you did was right (or wrong as it were). A perfect example of this was ME- I'm not a huge Fuente fan- so while I had seen or read about the now infamous Between the Lines- I had no idea about its rarity... Even searching around WITHOUT the others chiming in would not had informed me of its rarity, only its price. And since I never set out to try and get one personally- I simply didn't know. Same for the Partagas 150, again- I had no idea. So player interaction in a pass is a good thing.
Also- I feel its the responsibility of the players in the pass to police the pass, plus I personally would like to see players who participate in passes STAY involved until the pass ends. If you're the first few players and stop contributing, reading and getting involved after your particular play is over- thats somewhat selfish in my opinion.... Granted I know everyone here has lives and time is a valuable thing, but I think joining a pass means you joined the entire pass- not only until you play then you're out. At least in my opinion.
So post padding is bad, but supporting the play of your fellow players is (to me) a good thing- A VERY GOOD THING.
Last, I do agree that all (or most) negative comments should be left to PM's, we are all adults and name calling is a bit second grade and tacky.... as mentioned previously, this is not the good natured friendly ribbing we're talking about here, its the outright hurtful comments being made- its a bit childish. :lookup:
:thumbs: Toaster
I agree and disagree. I agree that posting a positive "Nice Play" just for the sake of post padding is a bad thing IF THE PLAY WAS INFACT BAD, but I strongly support the players of a pass to encourage and support the play of other passers. As a pass originator and a player- I enjoy reading the comments made by the others, and I think more so as a player, I like to see and read the support from my piers and fellow passers to reassure me that my play was fair.
Not everyone here (myself included of course) are cigar experts or retailers... So knowing EVERYTHING is simply not possible, and it helps to have others involved in the pass chime in and let you know what you did was right (or wrong as it were). A perfect example of this was ME- I'm not a huge Fuente fan- so while I had seen or read about the now infamous Between the Lines- I had no idea about its rarity... Even searching around WITHOUT the others chiming in would not had informed me of its rarity, only its price. And since I never set out to try and get one personally- I simply didn't know. Same for the Partagas 150, again- I had no idea. So player interaction in a pass is a good thing.
Also- I feel its the responsibility of the players in the pass to police the pass, plus I personally would like to see players who participate in passes STAY involved until the pass ends. If you're the first few players and stop contributing, reading and getting involved after your particular play is over- thats somewhat selfish in my opinion.... Granted I know everyone here has lives and time is a valuable thing, but I think joining a pass means you joined the entire pass- not only until you play then you're out. At least in my opinion.
So post padding is bad, but supporting the play of your fellow players is (to me) a good thing- A VERY GOOD THING.
Last, I do agree that all (or most) negative comments should be left to PM's, we are all adults and name calling is a bit second grade and tacky.... as mentioned previously, this is not the good natured friendly ribbing we're talking about here, its the outright hurtful comments being made- its a bit childish. :lookup:
:thumbs: Toaster
I have been reading and following this tread, but not responding. Gibu's last post was so on point until I had to mention it. Gibu :thumbs: The need to constantly slap someones hand publicly for making a mistake is not good. I played in a few passes, and I am currently co-hosting one. I am sure I have made some mistakes along the way. I appreciate guidance that I have gotten and leeway I have been shown. As a newbie the later is most appreciated. LETS HAVE FUN
I think rarity should be taken out of the equation when trading. If the cigar is so rare and means so much to you than keep it at home. At a minimum annotate on the list that you need to be consulted before it is removed. The purpose (I thought anyway) of trading around cigars is try something new, and have a symbolic herf together. As a newbie I have not learned all about who's rare who's not, that's why I am here, to learn. If I send out a rare stick, I would rather have someone take it who has never tried one, but has been wanting to, than some aficionado who has several other rare sticks to trade with. What I am trying to say is take the stick give me equal value and enjoy it. LETS HAVE FUN
I am far from a padder, Heck I read way more than I post, but if I or someone comes up padding to encourage another brother than so be it. Because so much of the tone of a statement is lost when writing thoughts can seem more harsh then intended. We have to back off of some of the comments that can cause some reluctance in posting and in joing a pass. As brothers of the leaf we want teach and encourage, not punish and nag. LETS HAVE FUN
Toster you were also dead on with post :thumbs:
Just my thoughts
M3
I think rarity should be taken out of the equation when trading. If the cigar is so rare and means so much to you than keep it at home. At a minimum annotate on the list that you need to be consulted before it is removed. The purpose (I thought anyway) of trading around cigars is try something new, and have a symbolic herf together. As a newbie I have not learned all about who's rare who's not, that's why I am here, to learn. If I send out a rare stick, I would rather have someone take it who has never tried one, but has been wanting to, than some aficionado who has several other rare sticks to trade with. What I am trying to say is take the stick give me equal value and enjoy it. LETS HAVE FUN
I am far from a padder, Heck I read way more than I post, but if I or someone comes up padding to encourage another brother than so be it. Because so much of the tone of a statement is lost when writing thoughts can seem more harsh then intended. We have to back off of some of the comments that can cause some reluctance in posting and in joing a pass. As brothers of the leaf we want teach and encourage, not punish and nag. LETS HAVE FUN
Toster you were also dead on with post :thumbs:
Just my thoughts
M3
A simple line you learn as an apprentice to a shop supervisor in the Coast Guard: Praise in public, punish in private. If you are going to punish in public, it better be for a good damn reason. Such as and example needs to be made so this may not ever happen again. Food for thought.
Emo
Emo
cohibasurfer
one day older than dirt
- Joined
- Jan 7, 2001
- Messages
- 7,706
Nah... hey guys I know your talking about me. :sign: And that's fine. I just like things pretty much in black and white. I call a pigeon a pigeon, dosen't really make a difference if it's a homer or a racer , it's still a pigeon. I know that a few here would like this to be the Veinna Boys Chior, but the fact of the matter is we are all adults, and it's not church. We all have are faults. I guess mine is being straight forward. I don't think I ever attack anyone on the board unprovoked. I don't lay around like a chained dog waiting for someone to bite. And I 99% of the time try to discuss things through PM's. But some people just don't go for that either. They become uncivil and stuborn upon reproach.
It's true I have posted somethings that after I did, I wish I hadn't, but that happens in life, and this board is real life. We are all real people with real opinions and not all of us are going to see eye to eye. Just plain bickering is going to happen. Tell me that you don't see it in your homes and work places almost daily. What makes you think that it won't happen here? It's going to. And as long as people talk with out using vulgar laguage or attacking each others loved ones, then it's just that, a squabble. Heck me and Ricmac had a little disagreement, said our peace, now it's done and over. No big deal. I have no animosity towards him. He'a a great passer, great BoTL. We just didn't agree on something. Things have to get aired out.
Now when some one doesn't replace their takes with correct puts in passes, You don't think it's going to cause a little stir on occasions, especially when they are called on it? Well it is. Not everyone is going to say," I'm sorry sir , I'll put another. And so when they don't, the group needs to stand up and show what we have learned to agree with as a whole. We are suppose to support what we as CP have as standards. And if the people want to disagree, then they can find another site like ROD & Co. have said.
Now I propose that all of you (and I'm not saying this to be fastidious) that want to see a little more sugar coating when a player needs a little chatting with. Please step up to the plate and show the support yourself. Because It's easy to sit back and say how you think it should be done. It's different when you actually do it.
By the way ... nice feed back going on here by everyone. Thanks for the posts. I mean it! :thumbs:
It's true I have posted somethings that after I did, I wish I hadn't, but that happens in life, and this board is real life. We are all real people with real opinions and not all of us are going to see eye to eye. Just plain bickering is going to happen. Tell me that you don't see it in your homes and work places almost daily. What makes you think that it won't happen here? It's going to. And as long as people talk with out using vulgar laguage or attacking each others loved ones, then it's just that, a squabble. Heck me and Ricmac had a little disagreement, said our peace, now it's done and over. No big deal. I have no animosity towards him. He'a a great passer, great BoTL. We just didn't agree on something. Things have to get aired out.
Now when some one doesn't replace their takes with correct puts in passes, You don't think it's going to cause a little stir on occasions, especially when they are called on it? Well it is. Not everyone is going to say," I'm sorry sir , I'll put another. And so when they don't, the group needs to stand up and show what we have learned to agree with as a whole. We are suppose to support what we as CP have as standards. And if the people want to disagree, then they can find another site like ROD & Co. have said.
Now I propose that all of you (and I'm not saying this to be fastidious) that want to see a little more sugar coating when a player needs a little chatting with. Please step up to the plate and show the support yourself. Because It's easy to sit back and say how you think it should be done. It's different when you actually do it.
By the way ... nice feed back going on here by everyone. Thanks for the posts. I mean it! :thumbs:
cohibasurfer
one day older than dirt
- Joined
- Jan 7, 2001
- Messages
- 7,706
Hey Joeketeer. Your one of the reasons I log on everyday. I never know what I'm going to see... LMAO!
Your TFF!!!
Thanks for the laughs, I needed it today too!
Your TFF!!!
Thanks for the laughs, I needed it today too!
For the record, when I said it was childish and second grade like to be hurtful in text and comment, I'm not singling out any one person- there have been MANY people doing this back and forth... Honestly I'm not impressed. I agree that with strong minded people- opinions will differ, thats human nature I'm just not a fan of name calling (though I'm guilty of it myself :lookup: ).
I also agree that we all should step up and police the group and passes, like I said earlier. I will admit that CohibaSurfer is a real standup guy for taking the initiative to say what sometimes needs to be said. Thats not ass kissing Mike, thats honesty...**** stir'er!
Its hard for any one person to be the heavy, and it does make things easier on everyone involved if other people help point out misguided or wrong plays... And again, I agree we should all step up and try to be more interactive in passes we're involved in (see my earlier post- once in a pass, you should be involved to the end of the pass, not only until the end of your play in that pass)
As for rarity of a certain cigar not being considered when Putting/Taking in a pass- I like the concept of letting someone else take or experience the rare cigar instead of someone who has many rare or similar sticks... HOWEVER a better way to play the rare cigar card is, if you see someone who is interested in a rare cigar you have, instead of putting it in a pass- work out a personal private trade for whatever makes both parties happy (someone did it for me!!!
:thumbs: Thank whoever you are 
) However, once a rare/special cigar is placed in a pass by whomever- the rarity must be, and will be considered for a fair trade- That's just the way of it. :thumbs:
I'm just not a fan of name calling (though I'm guilty of it myself :lookup: ).I also agree that we all should step up and police the group and passes, like I said earlier. I will admit that CohibaSurfer is a real standup guy for taking the initiative to say what sometimes needs to be said. Thats not ass kissing Mike, thats honesty...**** stir'er!
Its hard for any one person to be the heavy, and it does make things easier on everyone involved if other people help point out misguided or wrong plays... And again, I agree we should all step up and try to be more interactive in passes we're involved in (see my earlier post- once in a pass, you should be involved to the end of the pass, not only until the end of your play in that pass)As for rarity of a certain cigar not being considered when Putting/Taking in a pass- I like the concept of letting someone else take or experience the rare cigar instead of someone who has many rare or similar sticks... HOWEVER a better way to play the rare cigar card is, if you see someone who is interested in a rare cigar you have, instead of putting it in a pass- work out a personal private trade for whatever makes both parties happy (someone did it for me!!!
:thumbs: Thank whoever you are ) However, once a rare/special cigar is placed in a pass by whomever- the rarity must be, and will be considered for a fair trade- That's just the way of it. :thumbs:
cohibasurfer
one day older than dirt
- Joined
- Jan 7, 2001
- Messages
- 7,706
Help! Moderators! Toaster called me **** stirer..... HELP!
LOL!
And who in there right mind would trade you a rare cigar Toaster! Ha... I pitty the fool! Tell me who it was so I can call him some names... the idiot.
Now a serious point. I don't think that posting questions, or PMing passers, can only be done by members of said pass. If I have a question, orbetter yet a problem and I'm not in the pass. Nothing wrong with Pming people or posting to get my answers. I have in several occassions been responded to with, " Your not in the pass, so mind your own buisness. Eeehhhhhng! WRONG! Everyone has a right to find out what's up! Now it certainly doesn't mean I'm going to like what I read in return. But we all have a right on this public forum to make and ask for points to be made.
Don't you agree?
LOL!
And who in there right mind would trade you a rare cigar Toaster! Ha... I pitty the fool! Tell me who it was so I can call him some names... the idiot.
Now a serious point. I don't think that posting questions, or PMing passers, can only be done by members of said pass. If I have a question, orbetter yet a problem and I'm not in the pass. Nothing wrong with Pming people or posting to get my answers. I have in several occassions been responded to with, " Your not in the pass, so mind your own buisness. Eeehhhhhng! WRONG! Everyone has a right to find out what's up! Now it certainly doesn't mean I'm going to like what I read in return. But we all have a right on this public forum to make and ask for points to be made.
Don't you agree?
100%.... I agree with you 100%
I'm sure we all agree that no one person should have the "cp cop" title, we should all "police" the entire site (which may be the wrong term, but I think it gets the point across)
And this may not be taken well, what I'm about to say- but here goes anyway. I would like to the see the FOGs get more involved with us common folks... join some of the passes we start. You don't have to put in the Rolls Royce sticks we all know you guys have- but I think an example by action might be a more effective teaching tool than example by words only... It would be nice to see the older guys get involved in a few non-private, invitation only, super elite, extremely rare, edicion limitada passes... And join the hamburger helper eaters passes too!
Again just my opinion.
I PM'd you the really nasty stuff!
I'm sure we all agree that no one person should have the "cp cop" title, we should all "police" the entire site (which may be the wrong term, but I think it gets the point across)
And this may not be taken well, what I'm about to say- but here goes anyway. I would like to the see the FOGs get more involved with us common folks... join some of the passes we start. You don't have to put in the Rolls Royce sticks we all know you guys have- but I think an example by action might be a more effective teaching tool than example by words only... It would be nice to see the older guys get involved in a few non-private, invitation only, super elite, extremely rare, edicion limitada passes... And join the hamburger helper eaters passes too!
Again just my opinion.
I PM'd you the really nasty stuff!
You know I have no idea why you have to be so mean to me all the time Michael. Even if it is all true you didn't have to say it. :angry: :sign: :sign: :sign:JOE.M. said:Wow Mike, I don't think that was called for.cohibasurfer said:It may be true, but uncalled for!
Nice catch Joe, thanks for looking out for me.
I'll be the very first to say Michael's an asset to our community and is a great guy to boot. I in no way directed any of my comments at any one person specifically, and I'm being very honest about that. He takes the time to watch a lot of backs that others including myself just don't take the time to do. I have no problems at all with you watching out for us all Michael.
I also have no problems with brothers looking out for each other weather your actually in the particualr pass or not. We should all look out for each other without restrictions.
If some of the things I said made anyone feel like I was talking about them, then perhaps I was to some degree but not specifically and thats for each person to decide for themselves.
I really am serious about what I said though and feel it's better to be respectful of someone while disagreeing with them then degrade and disrespect them in public and expect that approach to solve the problem in issue. Firm strong disagreement is still possible while still be respectful of each other. We want to help those that are falling short in some way rise up and meet our expectations rather then degrade them and expect them to either go away or magically fix themselves. How do they improve without our help? How do they learn without our guidence? The only other alternative is for this community to shrink back to the numbers of old by driving people away and thats just not going to happen. Besides, how many realativly new people have turned into great members? Lots of them. Especially Cohibasurfer. :thumbs:
cohibasurfer
one day older than dirt
- Joined
- Jan 7, 2001
- Messages
- 7,706
Thanks Gibu!
Now let's post a whole bunch to protect brother Toaster. Maybe we can bury his post. Cuz when you shake the apple tree ... they hurt when they start falling from the top and hitting you in the head! LOL ...
Run Toatser.... Run!
In defense of "the FOG's" that toaster referes to. They are not like I. They do not argue. They do not redicule. They do however set a standard that should be strived to reach. And I don't mean the $ amount of the cigars they smoke. It's the courtesy and class they project here. They have done their tour on the front lines. Hell, they put up with me for years! And more so yet... they still are! LMAO!!!!
Now let's post a whole bunch to protect brother Toaster. Maybe we can bury his post. Cuz when you shake the apple tree ... they hurt when they start falling from the top and hitting you in the head! LOL ...
Run Toatser.... Run!
In defense of "the FOG's" that toaster referes to. They are not like I. They do not argue. They do not redicule. They do however set a standard that should be strived to reach. And I don't mean the $ amount of the cigars they smoke. It's the courtesy and class they project here. They have done their tour on the front lines. Hell, they put up with me for years!
And more so yet... they still are! LMAO!!!!
Gunpowder
Cigar Search & destroy V 1.20
- Joined
- Nov 2, 2003
- Messages
- 1,401
I agree It would be nice to have 1 FOG per Pass.Toaster said:And this may not be taken well, what I'm about to say- but here goes anyway. I would like to the see the FOGs get more involved with us common folks... join some of the passes we start. You don't have to put in the Rolls Royce sticks we all know you guys have- but I think an example by action might be a more effective teaching tool than example by words only... It would be nice to see the older guys get involved in a few non-private, invitation only, super elite, extremely rare, edicion limitada passes... And join the hamburger helper eaters passes too!
It was also said previously that Pass members need to stay involved all the way through the Pass. I was cursed or gifted to be placed last in my last Pass. Although I did my research, the usual PM'ing my proposed P/T to a FOG, chat room consultation, and other members (Fast, Phil, et.al), I heard crickets for the most part when I posted my proposed list to the actual pass. With only a little feedback by a couple of Pass members who acknowledged they were unfamiliar with the sticks involved, I decided to pad 1 more premium stick just to be safe ... and for my appreciation for being in the Pass.
Sometimes the end of the line is lonely but quite rewarding although as mentioned previously the shipping does not make the end of the line good financially considering cost per stick.
Well a lot of the FOG's don't smoke what's in normal passes. So taking sticks that they do not smoke doesn't make sense. I have been on the board for about 2 years. I have started 1 semi-invitation only pass, a mid level pass, and a few low end passes. The are FOG's that are more fogey than I am. I am sure many will say the same thing.Toaster said:100%.... I agree with you 100%
I'm sure we all agree that no one person should have the "cp cop" title, we should all "police" the entire site (which may be the wrong term, but I think it gets the point across)
And this may not be taken well, what I'm about to say- but here goes anyway. I would like to the see the FOGs get more involved with us common folks... join some of the passes we start. You don't have to put in the Rolls Royce sticks we all know you guys have- but I think an example by action might be a more effective teaching tool than example by words only... It would be nice to see the older guys get involved in a few non-private, invitation only, super elite, extremely rare, edicion limitada passes... And join the hamburger helper eaters passes too!
Again just my opinion.
I PM'd you the really nasty stuff!
I don't think us joining passes is going to "help" this site any more. It will over expose some members. Eventually they will get tired of being a "babysitter", and members will get tired of being "babysitted". There is an anti-FOG sentiment by some people as it is.
The people that have time and energy to keep things running smoothely have volunteered their time and energy. If you think something should change, maybe you should volunteer to do something. IMO self regulation is working ok, why make a change.
Emo
Gunpowder
Cigar Search & destroy V 1.20
- Joined
- Nov 2, 2003
- Messages
- 1,401
Well a lot of the FOG's don't smoke what's in normal passes. So taking sticks that they do not smoke doesn't make sense. I have been on the board for about 2 years. I have started 1 semi-invitation only pass, a mid level pass, and a few low end passes. The are FOG's that are more fogey than I am. I am sure many will say the same thing.
I don't think us joining passes is going to "help" this site any more. It will over expose some members. Eventually they will get tired of being a "babysitter", and members will get tired of being "babysitted". There is an anti-FOG sentiment by some people as it is.
The people that have time and energy to keep things running smoothely have volunteered their time and energy. If you think something should change, maybe you should volunteer to do something. IMO self regulation is working ok, why make a change.
Emo [/quote]
Good point. You guys have enough **** to deal with From my experience on the three Pass's I am involved in everything is going great except for that problem with Triple_D's pass at the beginning. Quite a few FNG's in these Pass's and they seem to want to comunicate their questions quite well and cross their "t's". A very friendly atmosphere to particapate in so far.
Maybe this is much to do about nothing except for those few exceptions.
I don't think us joining passes is going to "help" this site any more. It will over expose some members. Eventually they will get tired of being a "babysitter", and members will get tired of being "babysitted". There is an anti-FOG sentiment by some people as it is.
The people that have time and energy to keep things running smoothely have volunteered their time and energy. If you think something should change, maybe you should volunteer to do something. IMO self regulation is working ok, why make a change.
Emo [/quote]
Good point. You guys have enough **** to deal with
From my experience on the three Pass's I am involved in everything is going great except for that problem with Triple_D's pass at the beginning. Quite a few FNG's in these Pass's and they seem to want to comunicate their questions quite well and cross their "t's". A very friendly atmosphere to particapate in so far. Maybe this is much to do about nothing except for those few exceptions.
I was mulling over an idea in my head last night. If you want FOG's to be more active in passes, maybe their role could be more of a mentor. Lets say New3b!e is starting a new pass. Being new and having newb's in his pass he is feeling overwhelmed or maybe has a lot of questions. Maybe he should PM someone who has participated in and started a few passes to kind of guide him along his first run. I am sure are plenty of good people here that would help out. That way you have help when it's wanted and none when it isn't wanted. Some food for thought.Gunpowder said:Good point. You guys have enough **** to deal with
Maybe this is much to do about nothing except for those few exceptions.
Emo
cohibasurfer
one day older than dirt
- Joined
- Jan 7, 2001
- Messages
- 7,706
Emo... If people starting passes don't want opinions (help) from anyone, not just long time members. All they have to do is state. It's ok to put any cigar you want for any cigar you take. There are no guidelines in this pass. Or This pass will be moderated by me only. Anything of that nature would let members know that help is not wanted. There is also the option I posted before, it could be made a PM pass.
I personally think that MRSP is the culprit of alot of the problems to date. That and the unawareness of where cigars can be purchased at the best prices. Rarity does cause problems too though.
I personally think that MRSP is the culprit of alot of the problems to date. That and the unawareness of where cigars can be purchased at the best prices. Rarity does cause problems too though.