Big stink about Shuji

[Big Slim Junior]

With regards to all this, "We are cleaning this place up, be careful what you say." What exactly does that mean? I can't believe that you're actually implying that any dissent will be punished in some way.

Why, is punishment bad? How else is self regulation going to work. By saying, "Please don't say bad things, please don't do bad things." Just don't stir the pot is all he is saying.
Emo

You are over-simplying the issue. How do you define "punishment?" When and how is it meted out? Can I be "punished" for merely disagreeing with someone? Define "stir the pot." I understand the meaning, but there's too many vagueries.

Lastly, back to the point... Do I think Shuji deserves to be kicked in the jewels? Where do I sign up?

 

[emodx]

With regards to all this, "We are cleaning this place up, be careful what you say."  What exactly does that mean?  I can't believe that you're actually implying that any dissent will be punished in some way.

Why, is punishment bad? How else is self regulation going to work. By saying, "Please don't say bad things, please don't do bad things." Just don't stir the pot is all he is saying.
Emo

You are over-simplying the issue. How do you define "punishment?" When and how is it meted out? Can I be "punished" for merely disagreeing with someone? Define "stir the pot." I understand the meaning, but there's too many vagueries.

Lastly, back to the point... Do I think Shuji deserves to be kicked in the jewels? Where do I sign up?

You brought up punishment, and I put it in a different light. I am not going to argue any point here. As far as stir the pot, you know exactly what that means. One example is asking what "Stir the pot means". As far as punishment goes, the only 2 recourses I have as a member is a public tongue lashing for improper behaviour, and making recomendations to the Moderation team. So maybe you should PM Leebo yourself.
Emo

 

[Lee]

Defending this guy may taint your reputation as far as I am concerned.

That's what I'm saying and if that bothers some folks, so be it.

Lee

 

[blair]

With regards to all this, "We are cleaning this place up, be careful what you say."  What exactly does that mean?  I can't believe that you're actually implying that any dissent will be punished in some way.

Why, is punishment bad? How else is self regulation going to work. By saying, "Please don't say bad things, please don't do bad things." Just don't stir the pot is all he is saying.
Emo

You are over-simplying the issue. How do you define "punishment?" When and how is it meted out? Can I be "punished" for merely disagreeing with someone? Define "stir the pot." I understand the meaning, but there's too many vagueries.

Lastly, back to the point... Do I think Shuji deserves to be kicked in the jewels? Where do I sign up?

Nobody needs to make these strick definitions. "Define punishment" "Define stir the pot." It isn't necessary. We are all intelligent people here. Just use your brains. You'll figure it out.

This is all much easier that many people are making it. I'm surprised that there is a need for rules. I'm disappointed that there is a need. It is so easy. People are forgetting to use their brains.

 

[SD_Stack]

I am astonished by the blind faith a few of you have in Sushi. After all that has gone “un-done” how could anyone still stand by him?

So what if everything shows up (even in exponential proportions) to what was expected! There were too many un-truths told before. Why would any honest person with good intentions say that everything had been mailed numerous times, yet nothing showed? I can empathize with Sushi and others who have problems but there is a thing called accountability. If a divorce or anything else put you “completely” out of commission, then the thing to do is get online and say, “I’m sorry, but my wife is crazy and I am locked out of the house. I am at the library using the Internet and all the cigars are with her and she has locked me out of the bank accounts. My phone number at work is ###-###-####. Call me to make arrangements so that I can take care of my responsibilities.” Hasn’t someone else mentioned “COMMUNICATION?”

Guys, he has told us time and again that he has had limited access to the Internet and his cigars. Limited? During the “limited” time wouldn’t it be wise to grab them during that “limited” time you had? Also, with such “limited” time, why would you use it so frivolously to build a website?

Are we free to join other boards? Sure we are. To me, it’s the thought of supporting someone who has obviously not gone out of his way to fulfill his obligations.

Tell me… what would it take for some of you peaceniks to recognize a bad seed when you saw one? The evidence is clear! To you I say, “Are you familiar with martyrdom?”

 

[Bat_Chief]

It's been 3 weeks and 5 weeks...obligations have not been met....regardless if anything even shows....if you don't understand that...you need to question whether you should be here.

Ohhhhhhhhhhh!....now THAT's what I'm talk'n about!!

Hoo-Rah!!

 

[Big Slim Junior]

I am astonished by the blind faith a few of you have in Sushi. After all that has gone “un-done” how could anyone still stand by him?

So what if everything shows up (even in exponential proportions) to what was expected! There were too many un-truths told before. Why would any honest person with good intentions say that everything had been mailed numerous times, yet nothing showed? I can empathize with Sushi and others who have problems but there is a thing called accountability. If a divorce or anything else put you “completely” out of commission, then the thing to do is get online and say, “I’m sorry, but my wife is crazy and I am locked out of the house. I am at the library using the Internet and all the cigars are with her and she has locked me out of the bank accounts. My phone number at work is ###-###-####. Call me to make arrangements so that I can take care of my responsibilities.” Hasn’t someone else mentioned “COMMUNICATION?”

Guys, he has told us time and again that he has had limited access to the Internet and his cigars. Limited? During the “limited” time wouldn’t it be wise to grab them during that “limited” time you had? Also, with such “limited” time, why would you use it so frivolously to build a website?

Are we free to join other boards? Sure we are. To me, it’s the thought of supporting someone who has obviously not gone out of his way to fulfill his obligations.

Tell me… what would it take for some of you peaceniks to recognize a bad seed when you saw one? The evidence is clear! To you I say, “Are you familiar with martyrdom?”

Ok, I'll admit to having blind faith.

As for the warning signs, I didn't see any posts on Shuji's other issues until the pass blew up. Again, my defense of the guy was on information I had at the time.

As for Shuji's board. I agree that Shuji shouldn't garner anyone's loyalty or respect even if he does ultimately fulfill his obligations to everyone here.

The real question now is: How do we move forward from this point?

 

[emodx]

We are moving forward daily. Look at all these posts. Some of it is gripeing, but most of it sreves a point. The point for all those who read it.

Emo

 

[Muley]

1. Let me just get this straight, anybody who sticks up for Shuji is also guilty by association?

2. Also I am wondering what happens if and when the unmet obligations start getting met.

1. No - just be careful, wouldn't people getting taken for a (what is it now, sixth?) ride.

2. Then those that were screwed at least get their money/gars back. He can sleep better at night in his own mind. He still has limited or no credibility in a majority of CP'ers eyes. That's all - nothing more, nothing less

 

[fllbrent]

First off- Thanks Rod for re-opening this thread.

I do not agree with everything within this tread, mostly the point of views expressed by the FNG's. By the way I'm a FNG too! But being told so many times (more than three) that the check is in the mail now I realize I have to listen to the FOG's because they said the stove was hot don't touch it & I did. Now I'm burned. Even if Shuji makes good, I'll never send sticks out without being paid FIRST! And that Sucks! I thought it would be nice for everyone to have their sticks before the holidays oh well.

PS Everyone sorry for not being a Policeman sooner. Shuji received his sticks on December 14th NINE WEEKS AGO!!!

I hope by the time this tread is done more people "GET IT".

 

[emodx]

Shuji apparently has plenty of time and resources on his hands. But those of you here who joined his Lotto know full well what happened here, shame on you! Everyone has a right to say what they will. By joining his site I hold no ill will towards you. But joining his lotto is a different story all together. Knowing full well he short changed members here. Well that draws the line for me. I know who joined and who didn't.
Simply amazing. :angry:

 

[JOE.M.]

Let me start by saying I don’t consider myself a FOG in any way, I don’t consider myself a snob or one to be looked at as the voice of authority either. With that said I do believe it’s time to set the record strait. When I first joined CP it was a place to call home. We were small, we were tight and we were friends. We watched each others back, and we gave the shirts off our back to help each other, we had fun! We broke some balls, and we shared in each others pain, but when it came down to it a few words on the screen made us friends. In the last few months things have changed, Rod {with good intentions} opened his creation to the web for all to see, and what he received in return was a headache! There has been a large influx of new members, granted some have been fine additions to this community and others, well, have done nothing but bring “our” home down. My opinion {again, not the voice of authority} it’s time to return to “home”. My belief, we need rules! You may think that that what I am going to say may sound like I am trying to turn this place into a dictatorship but it also seems like people have taken the freedom of this board way to far. I know I will make enemies, receive PM’s and may even piss off the moderators with what I am going to say, but this is what I believe in.

First I think you should have some thing to contribute to this site, weather it be a newbie {or FOG} asking questions, or a newbie {or FOG} with answers to help. Personally I think there are too many guys who are just full of it! Lumberg & 4aces for example.

I think that the intent of CIGAR PASS is just that! Cigar passes, trades and to help a BOTL who is in search of something they can’t find and to discuss the world of cigars in general. Not to take advantage of the generosity of the fine people of this board. Sir smokes a lot & shushi for example.

Next are those who like to stir the pot with controversial post, go on the defensive of those members who have wronged a brother {or brothers} or have become irritated with CP because the consensus has been to not post things out of text with CP MikeDevilsFan, gr8full2day and even Bo {as much as I like him, he should have stuck around and took the high road} Actually this list can go on and on.

I know we live in a FREE society were we are entitled to FREE speech and the FREEdom to do as we see fit. CP is also FREE You May say! Well you are wrong! This site was built and is paid for by Rod {far from FREE!}. It is his prerogative to do as he sees fit to change it for the better, if that means dumping forums and members than I stand by his decision AND IF YOU DON’T LIKE IT, GO FIND A NEW SAND BOX TO PLAY IN!

The above statements are not to be construed as personal attacks! These are observations, facts or what ever makes you sleep better at night.

Rod, Dave, Lee and Jeff. If you feel my post has stepped over the line in any way please feel free to edit or delete it.

* Side note! This post was approved by two of the moderators before posting

 

[Lee]

Geez, some folks will never learn! (Looking at Emo's link)

Not surprising though..... :lookup:

 

[Toaster]

For those of us who are not entirely in the loop on this Shuji deal? Have the cigars still not been received???

The box split and Triple_D's pass? Are they still in Shuji's posession? :0 :angry:

Just wanted a definitely clearification on this point.

:thumbs: Toaster

 

[Ellman]

Shuji apparently has plenty of time and resources on his hands. But those of you here who joined his Lotto know full well what happened here, shame on you! Everyone has a right to say what they will. By joining his site I hold no ill will towards you. But joining his lotto is a different story all together. Knowing full well he short changed members here. Well that draws the line for me. I know who joined and who didn't.
Simply amazing. :angry:

I am going to defend myself, and let you know that I was in the Lottery here I ran the Lottery here for a couple months, and I got tired of all the cigar snobs who joined a lottery the the only rule was send "2 sticks that you would smoke", complaining about the stick everyone sent out. I would tell them to join the high end lotto. then again the next lotto "I'm getting dog rockets"

So I went and joined a lotto somewhere else, maybe the fact that there are less people over there will make less complaining.

Now I dont know anything about what Shuji did or didnt sent to whomever. If you dont want to trade with me or let me in your pass,because I joined a lottery somewhere else. I'll cry on the inside. There are some good people here and some who enjoy being a pain.

I'm sorry if good people got screw out of money or cigars, but you sent stuff to some guy you met on the internet. If you read a story in the newspaper of someone who found a site on the internet where if you sent them a box of rare coins they would take some out and put more then they take. if you read that story you would say what was he thinking. Now i'm not saying that you should get screwed but sometimes **** like that happens.

Some of the people on this board could be killers, child abusers or drunk drivers who crash into minivans full of families. but you are going to hold it against me because i joined a lottery somewhere else? on a site with someone you dont like. This is school yard crap.

 

[Triple_D]

For those of us who are not entirely in the loop on this Shuji deal? Have the cigars still not been received???

The box split and Triple_D's pass? Are they still in Shuji's posession? :0 :angry:

Just wanted a definitely clearification on this point.

:thumbs: Toaster

Nothing has been received :angry:

 

[emodx]

Shuji apparently has plenty of time and resources on his hands. But those of you here who joined his Lotto know full well what happened here, shame on you! Everyone has a right to say what they will. By joining his site I hold no ill will towards you. But joining his lotto is a different story all together. Knowing full well he short changed members here. Well that draws the line for me. I know who joined and who didn't.
  Simply amazing.  :angry:

I am going to defend myself, and let you know that I was in the Lottery here I ran the Lottery here for a couple months, and I got tired of all the cigar snobs who joined a lottery the the only rule was send "2 sticks that you would smoke", complaining about the stick everyone sent out. I would tell them to join the high end lotto. then again the next lotto "I'm getting dog rockets"

So I went and joined a lotto somewhere else, maybe the fact that there are less people over there will make less complaining.

Now I dont know anything about what Shuji did or didnt sent to whomever. If you dont want to trade with me or let me in your pass,because I joined a lottery somewhere else. I'll cry on the inside. There are some good people here and some who enjoy being a pain.

I'm sorry if good people got screw out of money or cigars, but you sent stuff to some guy you met on the internet. If you read a story in the newspaper of someone who found a site on the internet where if you sent them a box of rare coins they would take some out and put more then they take. if you read that story you would say what was he thinking. Now i'm not saying that you should get screwed but sometimes **** like that happens.

Some of the people on this board could be killers, child abusers or drunk drivers who crash into minivans full of families. but you are going to hold it against me because i joined a lottery somewhere else? on a site with someone you dont like. This is school yard crap.

Right, but now knowing what he did, you take offense because I stood up and said something. It would be one thing to say, "Hey, I didn't know the full extent of his character", but you know now, and to me it sounds like you are happy with your choice. So be it, but don't get offended because of my choice. School yard crap or not, once you make your bed, don't be afraid to sleep in it.

Emo

 

[gr8full2day]

I believe the jist of Emo's and many others...no no...I think that Shuji screwed these guys here intentionally or not, he screwed them. I believe it to be in poor taste to participate in the above mentioned guys Lotto or website for that matter. He may set the records straight by making good on all debts and all may be forgiven, but I must side with Emo and the other FOG's on this one. Those involved may find it a little chilly over here for awhile. I hope this all ends up a big misunderstanding, but I am sure it will not. It may appear that there is great division amongst the members, but I believe we just need a little leadership to get us all back on track. I think that ultimately is how the "self-regulating" ideal really works. Shame on the guilty and shame on the complacent!!

Thanks for an awesome place to congregate Rod and the Moderators!!!

 

[Ellman]

Right, but now knowing what he did, you take offense because I stood up and said something. It would be one thing to say, "Hey, I didn't know the full extent of his character", but you know now, and to me it sounds like you are happy with your choice. So be it, but don't get offended because of my choice. School yard crap or not, once you make your bed, don't be afraid to sleep in it.

Emo

I still dont know the full extent of his character.

What choice am i happy with? the choice of joining a lottery because the one here was starting to suck.

As far as my bed and sleeping it. come on this is the internet not my life.

 

[cohibasurfer]

Well one thing for certain. Ellman ... "you don't get it."