So about tasting...

[Mr Peat]

First of all, you have to take into an account that a cigar isn't just ONE tobacco. You will generally have 3 fillers, a binder, and a wrapper. The wrapper which will account for 40 to 60% of the tastes you pick out. So I can't see how you can look at it in a "Macro" sense. Sure one can say this cigar sucked, was average, pretty good, or even great. But there is a flaw in that logic when you start to ask questions why you think that. If you look at it in the "Macro" point of view, you will basically end up with a review that just makes no sense. Now if you look at it on a "Micro" view, then you can actually say why this cigar sucked or was great. You have to have details to back up your opinion so it can be related to the individual reader. You understand the cigar you are reviewing and able to write it in a way that a reader may feel like they actually smoked the same cigar while they read it. I feel this approach when a reader feels like they experience is more rewarding of a review.

Example of a "Macro" review:

I smoked a Partagas Party Short and man did this cigar suck.

What did the reader get out of it other than it sucked? Absolutely nothing.

Example of a "Micro" review:

I smoked this Partagas Party Short and wow did it suck. First of all it had a tight draw that was part of the problem. The fillers just didn't go well with the wrapper. Etc etc etc.

I hope you get the point I am trying to make. I feel the "Micro" review is the best approach and if you want, you can then put a "Macro" summary review up like in the rating scale of 1 to 100 as a point system so that a reader may walk away with something more than just a simple word. But I still feel if you do a rating scale, you should provide some details to back up that rating. :thumbs:

 

[TheVitaleMob]

I'm glad that there was some good discussion here, but I think I need to clarify the context of my question a little bit. In my former life, I was a musician, and I learned to think of myself not as a single instrument, but one of fifty that make up a group. As a reviewer, and while writing a review, the macro approach that I am thinking of is of no value whatsoever. I certainly understand and agree with that view. I am thinking more in the terms of a setting where one has the ability to just sit down for a few minutes and not worry about anything other than centering chi or something like that. I am wondering if everyone just picks apart the flavors of the cigar, or if some people have the ability to see the cigar as a whole, the way you would a piece of music or a painting. Not good, bad or ugly; just i don't know, a cigar?

More thoughts and opinions?

 

[NorCalCigarLover]

I'm glad that there was some good discussion here, but I think I need to clarify the context of my question a little bit. In my former life, I was a musician, and I learned to think of myself not as a single instrument, but one of fifty that make up a group. As a reviewer, and while writing a review, the macro approach that I am thinking of is of no value whatsoever. I certainly understand and agree with that view. I am thinking more in the terms of a setting where one has the ability to just sit down for a few minutes and not worry about anything other than centering chi or something like that. I am wondering if everyone just picks apart the flavors of the cigar, or if some people have the ability to see the cigar as a whole, the way you would a piece of music or a painting. Not good, bad or ugly; just i don't know, a cigar?

More thoughts and opinions?

I think what your talking about is what Atuck stated in his response. Tasting a cigar is just that, picking out the particular components and the taste profile of a cigar. If what your asking for is of no value whatsoever then what use is it? Yes, it is a cigar. Yes, it is burning when lit. Yes, smoke is coming from it. When I look at a piece of art for the first time the first thing I decide is if I like what I'm looking at. When I taste a wine for the first time the first thing I decide is if I like what I'm tasting. When I hear a piece of music for the first time the first thing I decide is if I like what I'm hearing. But those are all very basic top level discoveries, it isn't until I do a deeper evaluation (review) when my appreciation for what they truly are begins to develop.

I can decide, and tell you, within seconds if I like something or not, but I can't tell you why until I've done some sort of deeper exploration of why. Some people, I actually believe many, just don't care about the why, either that or they just don't want to take the time as to figure out why. It's no big deal really, they just appreciate the top level discovery and don't need to delve into the why. I personally enjoy the deeper "why do I like it" exploration in art, music, food, drink and cigars, I like to call it an appreciation of these things.

 

[MiamiCubano]

Well stated NorCal.

To expand on this, and to put it in musical terms you might relate to...

As a member of an orchestra or some other musical unit, perhaps you thought of yourself as 1 of 50 instruments. But the accomplished conductor of your orchestra, hears, feels, realizes, notices, what have you, each member, each instrument, each nuance. It is in those details where the true nature of the entire being is found, some overriding others, some more subtle, etc.

 

[Ginseng]

Well stated NorCal.

To expand on this, and to put it in musical terms you might relate to...

As a member of an orchestra or some other musical unit, perhaps you thought of yourself as 1 of 50 instruments. But the accomplished conductor of your orchestra, hears, feels, realizes, notices, what have you, each member, each instrument, each nuance. It is in those details where the true nature of the entire being is found, some overriding others, some more subtle, etc.

Philosophically and eloquently put. :thumbs:

Wilkey

 

[TheVitaleMob]

I think what your talking about is what Atuck stated in his response. Tasting a cigar is just that, picking out the particular components and the taste profile of a cigar. If what your asking for is of no value whatsoever then what use is it? Yes, it is a cigar. Yes, it is burning when lit. Yes, smoke is coming from it. When I look at a piece of art for the first time the first thing I decide is if I like what I'm looking at. When I taste a wine for the first time the first thing I decide is if I like what I'm tasting. When I hear a piece of music for the first time the first thing I decide is if I like what I'm hearing. But those are all very basic top level discoveries, it isn't until I do a deeper evaluation (review) when my appreciation for what they truly are begins to develop.

I can decide, and tell you, within seconds if I like something or not, but I can't tell you why until I've done some sort of deeper exploration of why. Some people, I actually believe many, just don't care about the why, either that or they just don't want to take the time as to figure out why. It's no big deal really, they just appreciate the top level discovery and don't need to delve into the why. I personally enjoy the deeper "why do I like it" exploration in art, music, food, drink and cigars, I like to call it an appreciation of these things.

Well stated NorCal.

To expand on this, and to put it in musical terms you might relate to...

As a member of an orchestra or some other musical unit, perhaps you thought of yourself as 1 of 50 instruments. But the accomplished conductor of your orchestra, hears, feels, realizes, notices, what have you, each member, each instrument, each nuance. It is in those details where the true nature of the entire being is found, some overriding others, some more subtle, etc.

Well put guys. I guess that this is where I was going anyway, but I have a hard time explaining what I feel in words. Maybe that's why I write music... As kind of an example, I was gifted a HdM habano at the PacNW herf and would describe it as a study in contrasts. A very strong black pepper flavor underlaid(sp?) by a mild, airy taste that I couldn't quite define. True, I just picked the two flavors apart, but I thought of them more as being intertwined with eachother. I guess I'm just weird like that...

 

[Ginseng]

When I first started smoking cigars it was merely an enjoyable thing to do when at the local cigar bar. I was mostly enjoying the drink before the cigar (this was partly due to smoking Macanudos). Then I found cigar pass and the great reviews people were doing. That and being gifted a small desktop humidor so I could keep a small stash on hand.

When I decided to do my first review and really sit down and be a bit more thorough I noticed I was still leaning my opinions to the "where" and "when" and not as much the "what". At the time of most of the reviews I was in a great mood, had a mild drink and a quite night, which helped in picking out the subtleties. For example the CAO Sampler Review I was making notes on when the Maduro would the most enjoyable for me.

My notes took that a bit further and I specifically noted Good for poker. The reason is I have found fuller bodied cigars to be really great for me to relax and let do. I seem to do better in poker when I don't over think things. I know the tactics and percentages of most hands, but end up killing myself by doing to much thinking . So that point could be like a little secret weapon next time I sit down with the boys. That and the jealousy of the great room note would be nice.

Another example which I didn't do a review of here as I had no camera at the time and was behind at work on my coding was a nice AF Gran Reserva Rothschild that Swissy had sent me in the noob sampler. It really did the trick. I call myself a child of the Internet and video gaming. I have the attention span of a knat most days and need to be multi-tasking to stay focused. So when coding at work I often have something in my hands or drinking tea or even reading something on cigar pass on one screen and coding on my other screen. The AF was a very consistent and just good smoke. It didn't pull my attention away from work, nor did require alot of my attention to keep is lit (good construction). A draw every minute or two was all I needed to keep that smoke in air and my mind on the work at hand. I made special note of that cigar for the way it really just fit into that moment and state of mind.

In the end reviews for me cover the gamut of tastes, moods, events, timings, pairings and I guess in that final example even sentimental value. But that is really the point of the whole thing right? Just because I try and write this stuff down or take pictures that doesn't mean we all don't subconsciously draw these same conclusions and store them away in our heads. The other day I was smoking a wonderful Avo Signature at my new stomping grounds "Cigar Time" in Cerritos, Ca. the owner was also smoking the Avo Sig while we watched some basketball. I commented "I taste a bit of cinnamon here." he replied "I taste tobacco". Are my tastes more refined then his? Doubtful, since he is a sarcastic bastid... However, regardless I'm sure his mind has already pulled out all the juicy little bits from the taste, moment in time and feelings. It wasn't just good, regardless if that's all he could express about it.

Ok thats it from me, sorry about going way out there on that one. It happens when I get compliments!

Thanks for reading if you made it this far

Hoshnasi,

Thank you for expanding on your approach to reviewing. When I initially read it, I was under the impression that the occasion or circumstance of smoking took precedence over the cigar itself. But now I think that this is not the case.

In fact, what it seems like to me is that you use the circumstances to help you attune to specific aspects of the cigars characteristics or performance. In this sense, the cigar and the circumstance are a more contextually integrated. I now believe that this is perhaps a more "organic" approach to not only reviewing but also experiencing cigars.

By way of analogy, wine tasting in its purest form is seeing, sniffing, sucking, and spitting. It captures the wine in isolation. But this is not how I enjoy wine. True, practicing "tasting" can sharpen one's skills, but that is not the ultimate objective in my opinion. The objective of developing these skills and cultivating our perceptual abilities is to assimilate them and integrate them seamlessly into subsequent "real life" experiences. In doing so, we can enhance our daily appreciation of these things. Let's call it the zen of cigar smoking.

Thank you for your thoughtful and thought provoking posts.

Wilkey

 

[Infinity]

Interesting thread - perspective and opinion.

Here's my take on macro and micro...

When I anaylize a good cigar looking for taste, specifically when doing a review, I don't enjoy the cigar as much as I would
just smoking it. There is too much work and thought that goes into reviewing a cigar, not to mention the numerous interruptions
to take pics. I derive much more pleasure "just smoking" the same good cigar without thought or work, the way it is intended to
be smoked. So for me, it's about - ok, fair, good or excellent - I guess I'm a macro smoker.

Brian

 

[moki]

This may help: Cigar Tasting 101

 

[Ginseng]

Interesting thread - perspective and opinion.

Here's my take on macro and micro...

When I anaylize a good cigar looking for taste, specifically when doing a review, I don't enjoy the cigar as much as I would
just smoking it. There is too much work and thought that goes into reviewing a cigar, not to mention the numerous interruptions
to take pics. I derive much more pleasure "just smoking" the same good cigar without thought or work, the way it is intended to
be smoked. So for me, it's about - ok, fair, good or excellent - I guess I'm a macro smoker.

Brian

Brian,

Good point of clarification. Perhaps the zen of cigar smoking allows one to effortlessly ebb and flow along the continuum from the analytical to the holistic.

Everybody say along with me...

Ommmmmmmmmmmmmm, Opussssssss
Ommmmmmmmmmmmmm, RASSsssssssss
Ommmmmmmmmmmmmm, Ommmmmmmmmmm



Wilkey

 

[BlindedByScience]

I find that I can approach the smoking of a cigar from several different perspectives. On one end is the yardwork/crowded herf smoke. On the other end is the intensely analytical forensic smoke......

.....When I go hunting for flavors, that is when I least trust my senses and when I most suspect my expectations will manipulate my perceptions.
Wilkey

Interesting thoughts, Wilkey.

I have to admit that I'd discovered if I take a cigar I'd never smoked, and think to myself "...I'm going to really give this a critical review..." I rarely enjoy the smoke. My "new" procedure for new smokes is to buy three to five. First time I smoke a new stick, I try to do so later in the evening, when it's quiet outside, and not focus so much on the smoke as the overall experience. Macro vs. micro, perhaps. If I think it "sucked" I usually always try a second. If the call is similar, that's usually it for me and that particular stick. But - if I get through a couple, I can have a more "analytical" smoke and the details seem to be much more apparent and easy to express. I think the best reviews I've written were for old favorites that strike me out of the blue; "....ya know, these are really good smokes...." and the comments and tasting notes really seem to flow then.

...guess I'd make a lousy cigar reviewer; "....sure, send me a box and I'll let you know..."..... :laugh:

Best Regards, gents - B.B.S.