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Hygrometers, hygrometers, hygrometers, oh my!

John,

That is the crux of the issue. One or both of these two hygros is off but we do not know which and by how much. In essence, what the 4% and 7% differences means is that one or both hygros have a response curve that is faulty. To make a determination about which one it is, I would need to put both in another calibrated environment, for example a Boveda 65% pack and check indicated readings in that environment. That would seal the deal although three points would even be better, say 65%, 70%, and 75%.

No rest for the weary.

Wilkey
 
jfields said:
Ginseng said:
smellysell said:
Ginseng said:
Smellysell, you are right on. That would be the next step. Great observation. So, you wanna come over and do it for me? :D

Wilkey
Click to expand...

You providing the smokes and plane ticket?
Click to expand...
Hey,

If you can change a diaper on a two-week old and cook steak, you betcha! :thumbs:

Wilkey
Click to expand...

If he can nurse a two week old infant I would pay. I don't want to watch though. :sign:
Click to expand...
Eeeeewwwwwwww!

I have no knowledge of the existence or functionality of smelly's manboobs. And let's keep it that way.

Wilkey
 
Ginseng said:
jfields said:
Ginseng said:
smellysell said:
Ginseng said:
Smellysell, you are right on. That would be the next step. Great observation. So, you wanna come over and do it for me? :D

Wilkey
Click to expand...

You providing the smokes and plane ticket?
Click to expand...
Hey,

If you can change a diaper on a two-week old and cook steak, you betcha! :thumbs:

Wilkey
Click to expand...

If he can nurse a two week old infant I would pay. I don't want to watch though. :sign:
Click to expand...
Eeeeewwwwwwww!

I have no knowledge of the existence or functionality of smelly's manboobs. And let's keep it that way.

Wilkey
Click to expand...
LOL! Like I said I wouldn't want to watch. TMI
 
Hi Wilkey

Thanks for the time and effort you have put into this.I just wanted to add some thoughts. It is quite important to established at least 2 points of known humidity to predict the accuracy at other levels within the range of the instrument. Sometimes 3,4 or 5 test points are required depending on the range of the instrument and the range of concern. In the aerospace industry the calibration of measuring instruments is required and at 3,6 or 12 month intervals depending on the instruments ability to hold its calibration. This is established by statistical results of past calibrations and deviations from the test points. All measuring instruments that guage the quailty of manufactured items or processes must be tracable to the NIST(National Institute of Standards and Technology). I do not know if the Bovada packs give an exact 75% But I agree 100% with you that at least 2 points are required to establish a better calibration......Thanks again Wilkey for all you do here.


Bob
 
Wow... very interesting thread. Guys storing their smokes at 60% or 65% really need to take note if you "calibrated" your hygro at 75%. Thanks for the science work, Ginseng.

---John Holmes...
 
Hey Wilkey


I've got an idea. Lets get a hygrometer certified to NIST standards then have a hygrometer pass that everybody could calibrate the hygrometers to. :laugh:

















Just kidding


Bob
 
Bob,

I am uncomfortable drawing a line with just two points. If the work could be done with Boveda packs at 60, 65, 70 and 75, that would be ideal and allow for interpolation with high confidence.

Don't laugh about a NIST traceable hygro passaround. That is not out of the question.

Wilkey
 
Other than leaving out the effects of continental drift and coriolis force on a contrived environment, you've done an excellent job. BTW, you think too much. :sign:

Doc.
 
I don't know how I missed this..... good stuff and agree wholeheartedly that hygro's accuracy vary in different rh rages. Analog types work ok in mid level rages but are notoriously off when moving to the upper (where we would use them) and lower ranges. Digitals have less swing but still have a tendancy to follow the same rule.... the more you push out into the upper or lower ranges of the specific hygro you are using the more chance of swing.

For the most part the "quality" of the hygros most of us use for our cigars is not good enough to give you pin point accuracy. Most of the low $ hygros have a +/- of 5-7%. The ones used by us (mostly) in the $20-$60 range usually have a +/- of 2-5%. You have to get up into the several hundred dollar category to get a +/- of less than 2%. When we start throwing these +/- percentages around it can get a bit interesting.

Example: Take the 4% difference that was realized between the two hygros. If we'e using hygro's with a +/- of 2% (and I believe the Western Digital's +/- is greater than 2%) that 4% difference is easily accounted for and both Hygro's be considered in spec. Do we know the +/- rh% of a Bovada packs? When you start adding up all of the +/- % of everything including the Bovada pack trying to be exact on ones rh is hit or miss at best. For the most part we're "in range" which it has always been my experience good enough without spending mega bucks for a hygro that may only give you an extra 1% +/-.

I recall someone once telling me that in time, after storing cigars for years you will rely less on a hygro and more on the feel of the cigar. Kinda funny as last night I took a Fuente Cuban Belicosa out to smoke and it did feel a bit dry. I had my hygro's out of the humidor using them in a different experiment so I grabbed one and stuck it back in to find a 61 reading this morning.

....... and my wife had the nerve to call me anal. :laugh: LOL I bet if we wanted to we could solve world hunger..............






..... after we get the cigar world straighten out. ;)
 
Ginseng said:
Bob,

I am uncomfortable drawing a line with just two points. If the work could be done with Boveda packs at 60, 65, 70 and 75, that would be ideal and allow for interpolation with high confidence.

Don't laugh about a NIST traceable hygro passaround. That is not out of the question.

Wilkey
Click to expand...


Hi Wilkey

3 or 4 test points would be perfect for this application in the range you have mentioned.

The only problem with passing around a hygrometer is the danger of knocking it out of calibration by ruff handling by the shipper. Even good packaging may not prevent it from happening. We could try it though.


Bob
 
cigar smoke said:
I've got an idea. Lets get a hygrometer certified to NIST standards then have a hygrometer pass that everybody could calibrate the hygrometers to. :laugh:
Click to expand...

I work for a company that has to maintain government standards on RH in our classified labs... We have a few certified monitors that I might be able to do a sanity check against one of my own readers. Let me ask around a bit.
 
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