Cubans over rated!

[moki]

To each his own...if anyone has any Cuban Davidoffs or Dunhills that are plugged or otherwise overrated, let me know, I'll gladly take these useless sticks off your hands.

I've had enough of them that I'm unlikely to ever buy them again. Just not worth the rarity premium, IMHO, except as a special gift to someone.

 

[BobbyRitz]

To each his own...if anyone has any Cuban Davidoffs or Dunhills that are plugged or otherwise overrated, let me know, I'll gladly take these useless sticks off your hands.

I've had enough of them that I'm unlikely to ever buy them again. Just not worth the rarity premium, IMHO, except as a special gift to someone.

Let me know if you have any you'd like to get rid of.

 

[SamClemmons]

So then why are we giving it him? ??? This has been one of the least productive, least informative threads to cross this sub-forum in a long time. If it started to look like this was turning into a pissing or trolling match, don't we, as a whole have the experience and composure to shut it down?

Mostly everybody seems to have discounted the critical portions of his various posts:
What this guy has done is to toss out an opinion and then repeatedly harp on the tight draws he says he's been experiencing. He's given us nothing substantive to work with and yet we're getting all lathered up. Instead of trying to diagnose what's going on here (e.g., gather more information on specifics of his storage, vitolas, years, sources. etc.), we've spent three pages bantering with someone who's effectively been turned into a troll.

Three pages and 1,168 views and not a single thing has been learned. Not an optimal or constructive use of Rod's bandwidth if you ask me.

Wilkey

There're a few reasons to give it to him.

His reaction to the scrutiny establishes his intent here.
Members posting in this thread gain solidarity and camaraderie.
Members not posting but reading gain insight into the opinions of the guys posting here.
I give it to him because I want to. I enjoy it and I'm quite certain that if Rod has a problem with it he will say so.

If you don't like it, don't read it.

NA

 

[nubman]

"French wine is best"
"American cars are crap"
"Only Rolex knows how to make a decent watch"

These are statements of opinion, not fact. Any one of these statements can be easily countered with logical, factual arguments. The problem is that statements like this one:

I believe that the mediocrity that they continue to pump out falls way short of the perceived greatness that many people espouse.

...don't contain any facts. All they bring to the table is an opportunity to argue opinions and you can do the "...yes they are / no they aren't..." argument ad infinitum. I'd go so far as to label the OP "flame bait". My favorite dictionary defines flame bait as:

n. [common] A posting intended to trigger a flame war, or one that invites flames in reply. See also troll.

Long and short of it, nubman, is you're entitled to your opinion and it would be interesting to debate the facts but you didn't bring any; just incendiary rhetoric that can't be "proven" either way. Got to wonder why you'd post something like this in the "Island of Cuba" forums anyway. If what you are looking to do is start a pissing contest, please go somewhere else.

B.B.S.

I know that I'm entitled to opinion and that is what I shared. I can easily ask you the same question, where are your facts? What would you like, pics of all of the plugged cigars that I have tried to smoke? Maybe I can go out to my back yard and dig up the Monte #2 that's rotting back there. My sister paid $35 for that one for my birthday...what a waste! I'll send it to you as proof if you want. Maybe I can get some sworn testimony from some friends of mine that were present during some of the plugged smoke events. They can even sign some affidavits about their experiences if you would like. Maybe I have an old photo of the disappointment on my face as I smoked the Bolivar Royal Corona last year after reading that it came second on CA's top 25 of the year. The only FACT I claimed was my feeling towards Cuban cigars. I think the problem is that you do not share my opinion and you are frustrated that you don't have any FACTS to prove me wrong. "Incendiary rhetoric" is the best you can come up with? Maybe my opinion is incendiary to you because you are a little too sensitive. I am not trying to "prove" anything and don't feel that I need to. You stated that "opinions can be countered with logical factual arguments". So where are yours? If you don't agree with me then what is your opinion or your experiences? The best you can do is tell me to leave? Wow. I didn't even know what a "flame war" was until now. Sure I expect people to disagree with me but I also know that there are people that agree and share my opinion. Instead of getting pissy why not share your positive Cuban experiences? I'm a cigar lover like everyone else on here and I have had some amazing cigar experiences. Unfortunately I have had more negative Cuban experiences than positive ones, so when I came across this thread I thought that it would be the perfect place to vent my opinion on them. I was obviously wrong. If I knew that this was the 'everyone must love Cubans and agree on everything thread" I wouldn't have posted. And Sam, before you profile me again and say I'm playing the victim, the last thing I want is your pity. I have an opinion and if you don't like it too bad, I couldn't care less. Get an opinion of your your own and maybe you might have something interesting to say.

 

[Macion Grey]

First of all, I did post my experiences to the contrary, and found you simply to be a most unlucky person when it came to bad draws. I have had more Cubans than Non-Cubans, and I will continue that trend because I believe that the top Cuban sticks cannot be beaten.

Secondly, calm down a little, and don't get to defensive. You did post an aggregative comment, and it looks like you weren't expecting the obvious result of that post.



Just cool it, discuss and provide some more details to those who are questioning.

 

[souldog]

I know that I'm entitled to opinion and that is what I shared. I can easily ask you the same question, where are your facts? What would you like, pics of all of the plugged cigars that I have tried to smoke? Maybe I can go out to my back yard and dig up the Monte #2 that's rotting back there. My sister paid $35 for that one for my birthday...what a waste! I'll send it to you as proof if you want. Maybe I can get some sworn testimony from some friends of mine that were present during some of the plugged smoke events. They can even sign some affidavits about their experiences if you would like. Maybe I have an old photo of the disappointment on my face as I smoked the Bolivar Royal Corona last year after reading that it came second on CA's top 25 of the year. The only FACT I claimed was my feeling towards Cuban cigars. I think the problem is that you do not share my opinion and you are frustrated that you don't have any FACTS to prove me wrong. "Incendiary rhetoric" is the best you can come up with? Maybe my opinion is incendiary to you because you are a little too sensitive. I am not trying to "prove" anything and don't feel that I need to. You stated that "opinions can be countered with logical factual arguments". So where are yours? If you don't agree with me then what is your opinion or your experiences? The best you can do is tell me to leave? Wow. I didn't even know what a "flame war" was until now. Sure I expect people to disagree with me but I also know that there are people that agree and share my opinion. Instead of getting pissy why not share your positive Cuban experiences? I'm a cigar lover like everyone else on here and I have had some amazing cigar experiences. Unfortunately I have had more negative Cuban experiences than positive ones, so when I came across this thread I thought that it would be the perfect place to vent my opinion on them. I was obviously wrong. If I knew that this was the 'everyone must love Cubans and agree on everything thread" I wouldn't have posted. And Sam, before you profile me again and say I'm playing the victim, the last thing I want is your pity. I have an opinion and if you don't like it too bad, I couldn't care less. Get an opinion of your your own and maybe you might have something interesting to say.

The "RETURN" and/or "ENTER" button is your friend, NOT YOUR ENEMY. I had a hard time reading it all smooshed together like that.




Just a thought. Also, yeah, you should simmer down before this gets worse. Just an observer's observations. :whistling: :whistling: :whistling:

 

[Infinity]

I know that I'm entitled to opinion and that is what I shared. I can easily ask you the same question, where are your facts? What would you like, pics of all of the plugged cigars that I have tried to smoke? Maybe I can go out to my back yard and dig up the Monte #2 that's rotting back there. My sister paid $35 for that one for my birthday...what a waste! I'll send it to you as proof if you want. Maybe I can get some sworn testimony from some friends of mine that were present during some of the plugged smoke events. They can even sign some affidavits about their experiences if you would like. Maybe I have an old photo of the disappointment on my face as I smoked the Bolivar Royal Corona last year after reading that it came second on CA's top 25 of the year. The only FACT I claimed was my feeling towards Cuban cigars. I think the problem is that you do not share my opinion and you are frustrated that you don't have any FACTS to prove me wrong. "Incendiary rhetoric" is the best you can come up with? Maybe my opinion is incendiary to you because you are a little too sensitive. I am not trying to "prove" anything and don't feel that I need to. You stated that "opinions can be countered with logical factual arguments". So where are yours? If you don't agree with me then what is your opinion or your experiences? The best you can do is tell me to leave? Wow. I didn't even know what a "flame war" was until now. Sure I expect people to disagree with me but I also know that there are people that agree and share my opinion. Instead of getting pissy why not share your positive Cuban experiences? I'm a cigar lover like everyone else on here and I have had some amazing cigar experiences. Unfortunately I have had more negative Cuban experiences than positive ones, so when I came across this thread I thought that it would be the perfect place to vent my opinion on them. I was obviously wrong. If I knew that this was the 'everyone must love Cubans and agree on everything thread" I wouldn't have posted. And Sam, before you profile me again and say I'm playing the victim, the last thing I want is your pity. I have an opinion and if you don't like it too bad, I couldn't care less. Get an opinion of your your own and maybe you might have something interesting to say.

The "RETURN" and/or "ENTER" button is your friend, NOT YOUR ENEMY. I had a hard time reading it all smooshed together like that.




Just a thought. Also, yeah, you should simmer down before this gets worse. Just an observer's observations. :whistling: :whistling: :whistling:

It's not only you that has a hard time reading it. The fact is, the human brain cannot keep focus when a paragraph exceeds 3 lines.

Nubman, I agree understand what you are saying in general, in that, you don't enjoy Cuban's because IYO, most are plugged. However, on the fact of it, your posts lean towards stirring the pot rather than discussing the LOT.

Brian

 

[B.HOBS]

Nubman,

Stop putting Cuban cigars on a such a high pedestal, then maybe you wont be so disappointed. Sometimes a cigar is just that...a cigar. No more, no less. I've had my share of plugs, CC or not. We all have, its par for the course.

I think this guy's case is now closed gentlemen. :sign: ...I doubt it. Sigh.

~billy

 

[merkinmullet]

nubman,

I think I read somewhere in this post that you have draw problems with your Cuban cigars.

-Do you have the same problems with NC cigars?
-How do you store your cigars (full 100 ct humi, cooler, etc.)?
-What type of humidification do you use (foam w/PG, beads, etc.)?
-What is the temp/RH of your humi?
-Have you salt tested your hygrometer?
-Do you let your cigars acclimate before smoking?
-If not, what are the temp/RH conditions of your tobacconisits' humis?
-What are the conditions of your smoking setting (outdoors in the snow, inside a dedicated smoking room, etc.)?
-Are you clipping enough of the cap on your cigars?


Since these problems appear to be exclusively yours, perhaps it is not the cigar. If you want to rectify the draw issues, we are more than willing to help with proposed remedies.

 

[Rod]

Out of curiosity, what are the conditions in your humidor? What RH do you typically keep your cigars at?

 

[Atlasm]

If you are encountering plugged cigars and truly wish to smoke it and not just toss it, then invest in a draw poker. Then you won't have to throw them away.

 

[Diesel Grinch]

No, no, no. You misunderstand. What you said was fine but not everyone appreciates my candor.

As far as "half of all Cubans being plugged", can you say: Look at me Look at me!

NA

Neal I read into it too much.

Neal it's only a dream of mine to be able to fill those pant's. Your smart and quick wit makes what I post look like babble. Just ridding your coat tails. No offense meant. If any off my comments are out of line I apologize.


DG

Do tell....and exactly what would you like to fill Neal's pants with ???

CS that's for a whole another look at me thread.

Nubman, you titled your thread "Cubans are over rated!" (overrated is one word by, the way). What exactly made you think that such a broad, generalizing statement wouldn't touch off a heated debate on a CIGAR FORUM? Are you honestly shocked by the response you're getting? Seems to me like this is kinda what you wanted

If we are going to quibble about grammer then ; "(overrated is one word by, the way)" , you put the comma in the wrong place, by the way. Actually I'm not shocked by debate at all. I'm a little disappointed that instead of true rebuttals backed by some sort of logic , I get an attempt at psyco analysis by someone who smokes a Cuban once a year. There may have been some slight hyperbole in my statement, but the fact remains that from my experience there are far too many duds being produced in Cuba. Also I'm not overly impressed with many of the blends, but of course that is just my own opinion. If you love Cuban's that great for you. I smoked an RyJ Churchill yesterday and it was fabulous, after I shoved a screwdriver half way down it to get a draw. My point is and shall remain that Cuban cigars in my opinion do not live up to the hype that they garner, and that non Cubans as a whole are much better than Cubans as a whole. I'm sure you will find several more grammatical errors in this post but maybe we can hear your opinion on the topic instead.

Nubman it's 2 Cuban's a year. At least on the glass top box it says Cuban. :whistling:


If you really wanted to discuss plugged cigar's you would have just stated that you are finding that a lot of your cigars are plug and is anyone else having the problem. Your Cubans are overrated title is just to get a reaction. This was pointed out by a few people.

What I want to know is why you are still smoking Cubans if half are plugged? If I had that issue I would do a few things.

1. Check how I'm storing them.
2. Try a different supplier.
3. Stop buying them.

If I had a 50% chance of having a plugged cigar and knew I would be working on it I wouldn't be buying them because I wouldn't be enjoying the cigar if I had to worry about it. Cigar's are to be enjoyed. If you can't enjoy it then don't bother.


DG

 

[NiteSeer]

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

 

[BlindedByScience]

.......Get an opinion of your your own and maybe you might have something interesting to say.

Edited......you know, nubman, you're not worth it. No more gas on the fire....B.B.S.

 

[mmburtch]

I have friends that bring me cigars back from there all the time.

Fortunately I don't pay Canadian prices for them too often...

No offence, but these two comments from your original post, combined with your experiences as stated through out, beg the question, "Are you sure you're smoking factory rolled Cuban cigars?"

Without discussing sources, short of my friends purchaced them at the government store for me when in Cuba, are you sure of your sources? The last time I was in Canada, I had the oppertunity to buy genuine Coobans in half the convience stores in Vancouver.

 

[nubman]

​

Well, I try to keep my cigars between 65 and 70% RH. In the winter I am only able to keep the box (200ct) at 63% but when the warmer temps come I am able to keep it at 67% where I really like it. I have what I think is a reliable digital hygrometer/thermometer. I have salt tested my analogue hygrometer that I also keep in there and have calibrated it accordingly. I don't find the analogue to be very accurate or sensitive to fluctuations. I have smoked the odd cigar that has been over humidified and know what that is like, slightly different than getting a plugged one.

I have a couple of friends who go to Cuba twice a year and they usually bring me some back. And no they are not purchasing them on the beach, they are getting them from proper sources. These are cigar enthusiast as well so they are educated on what they are doing. I also on occasion go to one of several B+M's in my vicinity to pick up a single or two when I want to try something new.

I know it is easy to say "stop smoking them", but I am like everyone else whereas I read alot about cigars and am always looking to find great new cigars to smoke. When I read a great review on a cigar I like to go out and try it. Also there are a few Cuban cigars that I really enjoy when I get a good one so I like to have some of those in the box on the ready.

As for a draw poker, I have several of varying sizes, ( basketball needle, 2 different mini screwdrivers, and a knitting needle). Unfortunately it seems I have to use these far too often. Most of the time poking them does help but sometimes it has no positive effect. The only non Cuban I have had to consistently poke is my Short Stories. I think this has to do with the shape though, and they are normally only plugged right at the head so they are easy to open up.

Looking at the title of my original post I can understand how people might get the wrong impression of what I am trying to say. I honestly didn't have the intention of being so provocative but I guess it's too late for that now...lol! Originally I didn't even have a title for my post but had to put one in. I guess I should have put a little more thought into it. It IS my opinion that Cuban cigar makers, and some of the big names to be specific (Montecristo, Partagas, RyJ) have some work to do to live up to their names. I mean when someone has to pay $35 for a single cigar, the least it can do is draw properly. As for blends and flavors I agree that is truly subjective and to each his own. I have a feeling though that if makers like the Fuente's, Padrons, and DPG were making cigars in Cuba we would see some more innovation and better blends.

I appreciate some of the positive input and advice from some of the members here, and look forward to hopefully discussing some other topics here in a more civil manner. Maybe some of you can let me know what some of your favorite Cubans are and why. If I haven't yet tried them I will, and who knows maybe it will help change my opinion.
Thanks,

 

[nubman]

I have friends that bring me cigars back from there all the time.

Fortunately I don't pay Canadian prices for them too often...

No offence, but these two comments from your original post, combined with your experiences as stated through out, beg the question, "Are you sure you're smoking factory rolled Cuban cigars?"

Without discussing sources, short of my friends purchaced them at the government store for me when in Cuba, are you sure of your sources? The last time I was in Canada, I had the oppertunity to buy genuine Coobans in half the convience stores in Vancouver.

I can assure you that my friends know what they are doing when buying cigars in Cuba. As for here in Canada I don't buy cigars at convenience stores. A real cigar shop can only sell Cubans that come from Havana House, which is the only legal distributer of Cuban cigars here. When you buy at an established B+M it is an assurance of authenticity. Question...Why is discussion about Cuban retailers not allowed when on this page it is OK to have advertising by online Cuban cigar retailers?

 

[tone-ny]

I can assure you that my friends know what they are doing when buying cigars in Cuba. As for here in Canada I don't buy cigars at convenience stores. A real cigar shop can only sell Cubans that come from Havana House, which is the only legal distributer of Cuban cigars here. When you buy at an established B+M it is an assurance of authenticity. Question...Why is discussion about Cuban retailers not allowed when on this page it is OK to have advertising by online Cuban cigar retailers?

The ads are for those individuals that are not US citizens! Do yourself a favor and read the posts about the subject as you'll learn alot about Cigar Pass!

 

[mmburtch]

I have friends that bring me cigars back from there all the time.

Fortunately I don't pay Canadian prices for them too often...

No offence, but these two comments from your original post, combined with your experiences as stated through out, beg the question, "Are you sure you're smoking factory rolled Cuban cigars?"

Without discussing sources, short of my friends purchaced them at the government store for me when in Cuba, are you sure of your sources? The last time I was in Canada, I had the oppertunity to buy genuine Coobans in half the convience stores in Vancouver.

I can assure you that my friends know what they are doing when buying cigars in Cuba. As for here in Canada I don't buy cigars at convenience stores. A real cigar shop can only sell Cubans that come from Havana House, which is the only legal distributer of Cuban cigars here. When you buy at an established B+M it is an assurance of authenticity. Question...Why is discussion about Cuban retailers not allowed when on this page it is OK to have advertising by online Cuban cigar retailers?

Sorry to get a double response from you, it appears you posted the answer to my question about the same time I asked it. I hadn't seen the answers to those questions and felt they could be pertinate to your problems.

As for your question, it has been asked many times, and there are numerous threads with attempted answers to it. The best and most concise answer is however,

Because Rod Said So.

 

[rawrr]

I have salt tested my analogue hygrometer that I also keep in there and have calibrated it accordingly. I don't find the analogue to be very accurate or sensitive to fluctuations.

Maybe your analogue hygrometer is the problem.
I used to own 7 different analogues, but after I purchased my first digital hygrometer and compared with
them side by side, I threw away all the analogue hygrometers.

nevermind, I can't read.