VewyPhishy - fake cigars

[Bsneed51]

Okay, what's this I keep hearing about....Bolis???

Bolivar Platinum Medals are a brainchild born out of many hours of sitting around drinking, smoking cigars, and shooting the breeze. There may have been a drunk dial mixed in there as well....right Ed. :laugh: Don't worry Greg, once the boli pm's go into production you'll be near the top of the list get some. :sign:

 

[SPIVY]

Okay, what's this I keep hearing about....Bolis???

Bolivar Platinum Medals are a brainchild born out of many hours of sitting around drinking, smoking cigars, and shooting the breeze. There may have been a drunk dial mixed in there as well....right Ed. :laugh: Don't worry Greg, once the boli pm's go into production you'll be near the top of the list get some. :sign:

Joe doesn't say so. But I still believe it was a drunk dial :laugh: I will def join you guys next year. That was one of the most random things that have happened this year. I am still laughing about it.

Oh I think I have a box of BPM coming in...who is in for a group buy? Haha :laugh:

 

[khari]

Hey guys, I appreciate that you're creating a little levity, but we really should try to keep this thread on track.

 

[Napa_Smokes]

I am a little curious about what one should do if they do receive fakes. If they are expecting to get their money back should the cigars not be sent to the original seller? If you take it upon yourself to smoke one or dissect them to be sure are you then not accepting ownership for them? I just ask because if I were the seller and someone claimed cigars I sold were fakes I would make it right by refunding their money but would expect the cigars to be returned to me so that I would be able to follow up with my vendor in hopes that they would make it right as well.

 

[Kingantz]

I am a little curious about what one should do if they do receive fakes. If they are expecting to get their money back should the cigars not be sent to the original seller? If you take it upon yourself to smoke one or dissect them to be sure are you then not accepting ownership for them? I just ask because if I were the seller and someone claimed cigars I sold were fakes I would make it right by refunding their money but would expect the cigars to be returned to me so that I would be able to follow up with my vendor in hopes that they would make it right as well.

As far as my dissecting, if Michael had said to send the cigars for a refund, they would've been on their way. If I had any inkling that there was a chance of a refund, I certainly wouldn't have done it. However, after the responses received and then the non-response, I felt sure there would be none.

Say, hypothetically, I received these cigars and the band on the DC looked like the band on the Sublime, really no tell tale signs of a fake, and the RG/length actually were spot on. But, when I lit the cigar and started smoking it, I found it to taste nowhere near that of a Cohiba EL, but like smoking cardboard. I put the cigar out, dissect it to find trash tobacco, take pictures of what I find and send it to the seller, I would hope the person would still make it right regardless. They could use those same pictures to go back to the vendor if needed.

I would think, with substantial evidence a cigar is fake, the seller should make it right.

 

[siriusstoogie]

Okay, what's this I keep hearing about....Bolis???

Bolivar Platinum Medals are a brainchild born out of many hours of sitting around drinking, smoking cigars, and shooting the breeze. There may have been a drunk dial mixed in there as well....right Ed. :laugh: Don't worry Greg, once the boli pm's go into production you'll be near the top of the list get some. :sign:

Joe doesn't say so. But I still believe it was a drunk dial :laugh: I will def join you guys next year. That was one of the most random things that have happened this year. I am still laughing about it.

Oh I think I have a box of BPM coming in...who is in for a group buy? Haha :laugh:

I swear it was not a drunk dial.

BTW, I smoke a real Cohiba DC last night with the crew...it was deliciously smooth and complex.

 

[grateful1]

I am a little curious about what one should do if they do receive fakes. If they are expecting to get their money back should the cigars not be sent to the original seller? If you take it upon yourself to smoke one or dissect them to be sure are you then not accepting ownership for them? I just ask because if I were the seller and someone claimed cigars I sold were fakes I would make it right by refunding their money but would expect the cigars to be returned to me so that I would be able to follow up with my vendor in hopes that they would make it right as well.

I would not except money back for a cigar I've smoked or destoryed....I own it when I buy it.

If it's detemined there was 'intent' to defraud(the seller knew they were fakes)...then I'd like all the money back.
If the seller really knew they were fakes and got caught...well...they prolly won't stick around.

The unsmoked ones...I would send back for a refund.

That being said, it's the sellers call.

 

[bfreebern]

Hey guys, I appreciate that you're creating a little levity, but we really should try to keep this thread on track.

Yep.

 

[NullSmurf]

So guys, what exactly IS the expectation from Vewy?

 

[grateful1]

So guys, what exactly IS the expectation from Vewy?

Are we placing odds?

 

[dulaney22]

I think this post is beyond "jackable," so I'll offer this here (it's on point anyway).

I was given a Siglo VI by a local B & M. I have one other that I know is genuine. Now, the local one is pretty good looking and no real obvious signs of being fake, but it sure does have that "feel" to it. It's a little bigger than the other and the band is just slightly different (box around "Cohiba" is smaller and the letters are fatter . . . the band is not the exact same size as the real one either). Anyway, who wants to examine it? I'll take pics of the two when I get home, but I would rather a more knowledgeable member dissect it and compare with another of their own. Heck, it may be real for all I know.

Takers? Greg, Moki, Gary, anybody else . . . I don't care.

Edit: Sorry folks, this was poorly worded. I want to stress that this is for educational purposes, not source baiting.

 

[Niko]

I think this post is beyond "jackable," so I'll offer this here (it's on point anyway).

I was given a Siglo VI by a local B & M. I have one other that I know is genuine. Now, the local one is pretty good looking and no real obvious signs of being fake, but it sure does have that "feel" to it. It's a little bigger than the other and the band is just slightly different (box around "Cohiba" is smaller and the letters are fatter . . . the band is not the exact same size as the real one either). Anyway, who wants to examine it? I'll take pics of the two when I get home, but I would rather a more knowledgeable member dissect it and compare with another of their own. Heck, it may be real for all I know.

Takers? Greg, Moki, Gary, anybody else . . . I don't care.

I thought we weren't supposed to post "Are these real or fake" queries? Especially in this thread Dulaney, you know better than that.

 

[Kingantz]

I think this post is beyond "jackable," so I'll offer this here (it's on point anyway).

I was given a Siglo VI by a local B & M. I have one other that I know is genuine. Now, the local one is pretty good looking and no real obvious signs of being fake, but it sure does have that "feel" to it. It's a little bigger than the other and the band is just slightly different (box around "Cohiba" is smaller and the letters are fatter . . . the band is not the exact same size as the real one either). Anyway, who wants to examine it? I'll take pics of the two when I get home, but I would rather a more knowledgeable member dissect it and compare with another of their own. Heck, it may be real for all I know.

Takers? Greg, Moki, Gary, anybody else . . . I don't care.

I'd say send it on, however no Sig VI for comparison here. At least, not as yet.

 

[jayro75]

I think this post is beyond "jackable," so I'll offer this here (it's on point anyway).

I was given a Siglo VI by a local B & M. I have one other that I know is genuine. Now, the local one is pretty good looking and no real obvious signs of being fake, but it sure does have that "feel" to it. It's a little bigger than the other and the band is just slightly different (box around "Cohiba" is smaller and the letters are fatter . . . the band is not the exact same size as the real one either). Anyway, who wants to examine it? I'll take pics of the two when I get home, but I would rather a more knowledgeable member dissect it and compare with another of their own. Heck, it may be real for all I know.

Takers? Greg, Moki, Gary, anybody else . . . I don't care.

I thought we weren't supposed to post "Are these real or fake" queries? Especially in this thread Dulaney, you know better than that.

I'd agree Niko! This thread should stay on topic for the transaction in question.

 

[dulaney22]

I think this post is beyond "jackable," so I'll offer this here (it's on point anyway).

I was given a Siglo VI by a local B & M. I have one other that I know is genuine. Now, the local one is pretty good looking and no real obvious signs of being fake, but it sure does have that "feel" to it. It's a little bigger than the other and the band is just slightly different (box around "Cohiba" is smaller and the letters are fatter . . . the band is not the exact same size as the real one either). Anyway, who wants to examine it? I'll take pics of the two when I get home, but I would rather a more knowledgeable member dissect it and compare with another of their own. Heck, it may be real for all I know.

Takers? Greg, Moki, Gary, anybody else . . . I don't care.

I thought we weren't supposed to post "Are these real or fake" queries? Especially in this thread Dulaney, you know better than that.

Niko, my apologies to you and the board. I'm not trying to verify a vendor, just trying to offer food for thought on these issues.

 

[Niko]

I think this post is beyond "jackable," so I'll offer this here (it's on point anyway).

I was given a Siglo VI by a local B & M. I have one other that I know is genuine. Now, the local one is pretty good looking and no real obvious signs of being fake, but it sure does have that "feel" to it. It's a little bigger than the other and the band is just slightly different (box around "Cohiba" is smaller and the letters are fatter . . . the band is not the exact same size as the real one either). Anyway, who wants to examine it? I'll take pics of the two when I get home, but I would rather a more knowledgeable member dissect it and compare with another of their own. Heck, it may be real for all I know.

Takers? Greg, Moki, Gary, anybody else . . . I don't care.

I thought we weren't supposed to post "Are these real or fake" queries? Especially in this thread Dulaney, you know better than that.

Niko, my apologies to you and the board. I'm not trying to verify a vendor, just trying to offer food for thought on these issues.

Siglo VI by a local B & M.

Also, you live in Mississippi? How did you get a Siglo VI from your local B&M? Am I missing something?

 

[CigarStone]

So guys, what exactly IS the expectation from Vewy?

I think this is the key!

It's not about a long tenured guy getting fooled........it can happen to anyone!

It's not about the source........even the best source can pass on fakes I guess!

It's not about the time given to Mike to make it right..........he's proven he has no intent of even recognizing the issue by his PM words to Greg, Robbie, and Rod!

It's about his attitude, his complete lack of attempt to be a BOTL and it's about his ignorance in his choice of words......multiple times! (so the ability to claim an emotional outburst, or bad reaction, is kaput)

 

[stevehawk]

There will be plenty of people that will offer to make this right, if Mike chooses not to.

Correct. I have both the Sublimes and the DC ELs, and I will make it right if Michael chooses not to or ignores the issue.

Greg and Robbie, this really freakin' sucks guys but I'm sure you both know that this will be made right one way or the other. It's just how this place is!

Am I the only one that has a concern with this??

While I appreciate your generosity, Moki, I think it sets a dangerous example. The risk for entering into a transaction of this nature MUST rest with the buyer. If there's no risk, what's to keep the next person from buying cigars they know nothing about if the expectation is that "someone" on here will make it right. amateuraficionado's response implies that he already has this expectaion -- after all, "it's how this place is!"

Don't get me wrong. I know this a community and we look out for each other, but I also firmly believe that we need to take personal responsibility and begin to look out for ourselves at some point. If we handle purchases with the expectation that there is a safety net in place, what's to keep anyone and everyone from climbing onto the tight wire and trying to make it across the crevasse? Some folks need to fall and get hurt in order to ensure only those who are adequately trained should try to make the crossing. (Sorry for the piss poor example, but I hope it makes the point...)

If we want to go down this route, then maybe we need to look at revamping the Cigar Pass Insurance program to cover personal buys. If you do a lot of buying/selling, you may need to pony up to cover your risks.

 

[mufflerman]

Seeing as how he's deleted everything in his profile and locked everything else out, I think it's safe to say we won't be hearing from him soon. His pride got hurt and now his whole rep here is trashed.

 

[SPIVY]

There will be plenty of people that will offer to make this right, if Mike chooses not to.

Correct. I have both the Sublimes and the DC ELs, and I will make it right if Michael chooses not to or ignores the issue.

Greg and Robbie, this really freakin' sucks guys but I'm sure you both know that this will be made right one way or the other. It's just how this place is!

Am I the only one that has a concern with this??

While I appreciate your generosity, Moki, I think it sets a dangerous example. The risk for entering into a transaction of this nature MUST rest with the buyer. If there's no risk, what's to keep the next person from buying cigars they know nothing about if the expectation is that "someone" on here will make it right. amateuraficionado's response implies that he already has this expectaion -- after all, "it's how this place is!"

Don't get me wrong. I know this a community and we look out for each other, but I also firmly believe that we need to take personal responsibility and begin to look out for ourselves at some point. If we handle purchases with the expectation that there is a safety net in place, what's to keep anyone and everyone from climbing onto the tight wire and trying to make it across the crevasse? Some folks need to fall and get hurt in order to ensure only those who are adequately trained should try to make the crossing. (Sorry for the piss poor example, but I hope it makes the point...)

If we want to go down this route, then maybe we need to look at revamping the Cigar Pass Insurance program to cover personal buys. If you do a lot of buying/selling, you may need to pony up to cover your risks.

To tell you the truth. I never thought about it in the way you present it. The situation here crosses many issues, and we do not need to get into it again. I don't even know what to say in response. This is very interesting reasoning. ???