Officer Delays Man as Relative Died

[smokintexas]

Looks like a Dallas Police Officer thought that giving a man a ticket for running a red light was more important than letting him get to his dying mother in-law. HERE is the article from ESPN and a video as well.

It looks like had the officer let him get to his mother in-law Moats would have had time to see her before she passed. This is unacceptable in my mind, and am curious to see what some of you think, especially some of the fine officers that frequent CP. If it were you what would you have done?

Not only did this officer make it impossible for the man to say goodbye to his mother in-law, he still gave him the ticket!!

 

[PuroEsq]

I saw this earlier today and thought it was stupid. You could justify the behavior or the officer if the driver had caused a wreck, killed someone, brandished a weapon, or done something other than a violation of the vehicle code. Seems he could have just followed the guy into the hospital and issued the citation afterward if he really wanted. Taking the gun out and detaining him for so long when he knew the circumstances seems excessive.

What I did not like is that in the article I read the player/driver said that he felt that race had something to do with it because he and his wife are black and the officer was white. Not sure about that and I am tired of that always being tossed around. Of course we do not know the whole story and if that is the case then the officer needs to be diciplined up to and including termination.

My .02 ... and curious to see other opinions.

 

[BigJake6904]

I saw this earlier today and thought it was stupid. You could justify the behavior or the officer if the driver had caused a wreck, killed someone, brandished a weapon, or done something other than a violation of the vehicle code. Seems he could have just followed the guy into the hospital and issued the citation afterward if he really wanted. Taking the gun out and detaining him for so long when he knew the circumstances seems excessive.

What I did not like is that in the article I read the player/driver said that he felt that race had something to do with it because he and his wife are black and the officer was white. Not sure about that and I am tired of that always being tossed around. Of course we do not know the whole story and if that is the case then the officer needs to be diciplined up to and including termination.

My .02 ... and curious to see other opinions.

You can't terminate an officer for doing his job...unless you meant it was relevant to "playing the race card." Basically it boils down to ethics..."What would you do?" Personally, with that type of a story, I'd just let them go so long as there wasn't any serious incident as a result of their actions.

 

[smokintexas]

I saw this earlier today and thought it was stupid. You could justify the behavior or the officer if the driver had caused a wreck, killed someone, brandished a weapon, or done something other than a violation of the vehicle code. Seems he could have just followed the guy into the hospital and issued the citation afterward if he really wanted. Taking the gun out and detaining him for so long when he knew the circumstances seems excessive.

What I did not like is that in the article I read the player/driver said that he felt that race had something to do with it because he and his wife are black and the officer was white. Not sure about that and I am tired of that always being tossed around. Of course we do not know the whole story and if that is the case then the officer needs to be diciplined up to and including termination.

My .02 ... and curious to see other opinions.

You can't terminate an officer for doing his job...unless you meant it was relevant to "playing the race card." Basically it boils down to ethics..."What would you do?" Personally, with that type of a story, I'd just let them go so long as there wasn't any serious incident as a result of their actions.

I don't know man, put yourself in Moats' shoes. If you were unable to be at the bedside of your mother in-law just because an officer wanted to demonstrate his power would you feel differently about him deserving to be fired? The worst part of the situation is that it can't be taken back. An apology doesn't bring the woman back to life. I am not going to assume one way or the other about the race thing, I would like to think that wasn't part of the issue, but am also not naive to think that it hasn't happened.

I'm not saying that the man needs to be fired, but IMO whatever is just before getting fired is what needs to happen. I don't know if he can get demoted, or put on non-paid leave, but whatever the worst case is without him getting fired is what I think would send the best message.

In the end it's just a bad situation that could have easily been avoided.

 

[cigarsarge]

I've stopped people for doing the same thing. You can't allow people to endanger other lives by their actions. What if the driver in question struck a vehicle that had your wife and kids in it and they were killed or seriously injured? Is someone rushing to see a loved one that is dying worth accidently killing another? I say no...

But the officer could have used discression in citing the driver...I personally think a warning would have been proper.

 

[Footbag]

If it was me, I'd dial 911 as soon as I saw the lights behind me. I'd hope to turn the chase into a police escort. If he chose to give me a ticket at the hospital, so be it.

 

[smokintexas]

I've stopped people for doing the same thing. You can't allow people to endanger other lives by their actions. What if the driver in question struck a vehicle that had your wife and kids in it and they were killed or seriously injured? Is someone rushing to see a loved one that is dying worth accidently killing another? I say no...

But the officer could have used discression in citing the driver...I personally think a warning would have been proper.

That's a good point, one that from my point of view I wouldn't have thought of.

So pulling him over makes perfect sense, if I was the officer there is no doubt that I would have pulled him over. I guess the thing I'm having the hardest time with is the fact that even after the officer realized the situation he still detained the driver.

 

[AVB]

How many people actually like their mother in law that much?

 

[B.L. Sims]

All I will say is that both parties got caught up in the emotion of it all, and everyone could have handled the situation better. But this is what happens when you inject a whole lot of emotion into things.

That being said, what got this cop in trouble was the fact that he went shooting his mouth off issuing all kinds of threats and seemed to genuinly enjoy himself while detaining Mr. Motes, and at times, prolonging everything. DPD will be very lucky if they dont see a lawsuit out of this. The airwaves were filled with this today and I think the feelings of most people who were LEO was embarassment for how this officer reacted.

 

[NASTY]

How many people actually like their mother in law that much?

Good point. But he was driving his wife to the hospital as well. It was her mother that was dying. Had I been driving, I would've done the same thing. Had I been the officer, I would've went with him to the room to make sure he wasn't bullshitting me.

 

[cigarsarge]

Cops have to have a different mindset than the rest of the world. It's a matter of survival. I just looked at a media edited video of the incident...Keep in mind the media edits to suit their own agenda. I have experenced this first hand.

The cop attempted to stop the vehicle. The vehicle did not stop for about 20 seconds. When it stopped four subjects exited the vehicle and did not comply with the officer's verbal commands. That is enough to put the average cop on defensive...The cop did not know what he had. I personally would have drawn my weapon and got really nasty.

When the officer let two females leave the scent the remaining two males were uncooperative and abusive to the officer.

What I observed was a three minute video of a fourteen minute incident...The edited eleven minutes will possibly hold the key to what actually happened.

I do not condone abuse of citizens from any officers of the law...But their are two sides of any story.

 

[DesertRat]

DPD will be very lucky if they dont see a lawsuit out of this.

I think it would be hard for the plaintiff to win in court on that one. The lawyer for the officer would certainly put up the defense that he was doing his job and could conceivably have prevented the guy from killing someone if had had run another red light after being let go. The driver might figure he got away with it once he'll get away with it again and run another light.

Plus, what are the actual damages? The report I heard was that the mother-in-law passed away within the 13 minutes they were delayed. Would not being delayed have changed the fact that she died? No. Would she have been able to say goodbye to her mother and have her mother be cognizant of her being there? Probably not. Would she even have made it to the hospital and up to her room in that 13 minutes?

That said, if they do sue the city of Dallas will most likely settle out of court.

 

[ggiese]

I've stopped people for doing the same thing. You can't allow people to endanger other lives by their actions. What if the driver in question struck a vehicle that had your wife and kids in it and they were killed or seriously injured? Is someone rushing to see a loved one that is dying worth accidently killing another? I say no...

But the officer could have used discression in citing the driver...I personally think a warning would have been proper.

Yep - the knee jerk reaction is to think Moat was unfairly treated. Don't know - wasn't there. However - I have stopped people for doing over 100 mph racing to be bedside of someone that was dying - in the midst of heavy traffic - weaving - reckless. No apologies - I made them get themselves under control before they were sent on their way, or had another family member pick them up. It would have been crazy for me to allow them to carry on because their behavior was worse than most drunk drivers I've encountered. And I have met some pretty angry people during this process...

Given the circumstances - the man was in the hospital parking lot - I would have at least let him go to his Mother-In-Law with his wife, with instructions to see me later. If the situation warranted it (very dependent on circumstances) - I would have issued a ticket. However, most instances I would have impressed him with the foolishness of his actions and sent him on his way.

 

[ggiese]

All I will say is that both parties got caught up in the emotion of it all, and everyone could have handled the situation better. But this is what happens when you inject a whole lot of emotion into things.

That being said, what got this cop in trouble was the fact that he went shooting his mouth off issuing all kinds of threats and seemed to genuinly enjoy himself while detaining Mr. Motes, and at times, prolonging everything. DPD will be very lucky if they dont see a lawsuit out of this. The airwaves were filled with this today and I think the feelings of most people who were LEO was embarassment for how this officer reacted.

What you're saying doesn't make an awful lot of sense. Unfortunately, I don't have the luxury of knowing all of the facts. But - it sounds as though you were at the scene. Would you care to share with us what really happened?

 

[MX]

So, how many Monday Morning QB are going to chime in on this.....

It is hard for me, and I would think anyone, to say what they would have done. There were only a few people there that know the entire story.
I will defend the DPD for stopping the driver for running a red light, IMHO that is one of the most dangerous things an operator of a motor vehicle can do.

Again, I will not condone or condemn the Officers actions, I was not there, I can say that I hope the Officer can sleep at night knowing what his motivation was for his course of action.

Tim (13 years and counting of LE)

 

[souldog]

First off, from experience, people with "status" can come off as being above the law, due to their status. There's also a thing as "professional courtesy." This Moats guy may have felt that since he is one of Houston's favorite son's due to his NFL status, that he does not have to listen to the Police Officer. Keep that in mind.

Also, the Officer does the t-stop, in the middle of the night, and four people jump out and are non-cooperative. I'm sorry if I like to go home to my wife at the end of my shift, but if I do a t-stop and FOUR people jump out and there's ONE of me? I'm sorry, but my weapon is definitely coming out.

Also, Moats did not give the Officer a chance to give clear and concise commands.

Like George says, there's two sides for every story. If this was your average Houston citizen, I don't think there would have been any coverage of it. The race card is a bunch of bullshit that I am sick and tired of hearing. Everytime an Officer does something wrong to a person that is not of the ethnicity as the Officer, the race card gets pulled. Guess what? We're TIRED of it. I'll stop you and give you a ticket if your purple, the law is color-blind.


Finally, what I would have done is let the dude go. I would've said I'm sorry for your loss, we're here in the parking lot of the hospital, don't worry about it, go say goodbye to your mother. End of story.

PS- Coming off of a 20 hour day, so sorry if I'm not filled with gumdrops and sugary cuteness. :sign:

 

[DesertRat]

sorry if I'm not filled with gumdrops and sugary cuteness. :sign:

I knew something was different!!

 

[Jonesy]

What I did not like is that in the article I read the player/driver said that he felt that race had something to do with it because he and his wife are black and the officer was white. Not sure about that and I am tired of that always being tossed around. Of course we do not know the whole story and if that is the case then the officer needs to be diciplined up to and including termination.

My .02 ... and curious to see other opinions.

My feeling exactly Jason. The race card being played is the only thing you've heard out of their corner. Could the policeman used a little more tact, of course. But now read Soulpuppies post and see how far outta line the guy way. He was doing his job. He didn't know what was going on and then you had people jumping out of that car right and left....of course he should have had his weapon drawn. Shame on people who use the race card (this goes both ways) to make their story that much more appealing to those reading it in the morning paper. I bet Mr. Jackson will be making a trip to Texas shortly.

 

[khari]

I agree the race card gets played too often, but I also know there are lots of abuses of power out there by corrupted or racist officers, and the possibility can't be ruled out here. The officer was justified in stopping the car and even having his weapon drawn, but the article gives the impression he allowed his anger to taint his judgment. The DPD even said the guy never tried to use his status as a means of getting special treatment, so Jonathan's point about "people with 'status' coming off as being above the law" doesn't entirely apply in this situation.

You're right, Jonesy. The guy was doing his job. At some point it stopped being business and became personal, as evidenced by the fact that he continued writing the ticket even after another officer confirmed Moats' story about his mother-in-law dying.

 

[MoeCizlak]

The only thing that stood out to me was that the mother in law was dying of breast cancer. While this is tragic and her passing is definitely a loss, it's not as though she were injured in a car wreck and died suddenly. I would imagine that over the last couple of weeks/months, the daughter and Moats would've had several conversations with her about "the end" knowing that the cancer could ultimately claim her. I still would've rushed my wife to the hospital had it been my mother in law and probably would've incurred several moving violations in route. But the time I would theoretically spend with her prior to her passing would mean more to me than being there to watch her die.