Lower temp = better flavor

[vortex]

Just a quick hypothesis.

The taste is affected by a lower burning temperature. This brings out the more delicate flavors. When the tobacco is a bit drier the cigar(or pack) can be smoked more slowly without it going out and with an even burn and easy draw.

Don Pepin and Pete Johnson say we should NEVER store their Criollo/Corojo blends above 65%. I've found that even a bit lower RH brings out even more flavor. Of course, you can't puff away like a steam locomotive and expect this to work. I first noticed this when smoking an Edmundo and allowing it to almost go out which brought out other flavors that weren't present before.

Any thoughts/experiences?

Steve

 

[Ginseng]

Interesting point, Steve.

I've recently smoked some very strong cigars. So strong that I would normally not be able to handle them but I discovered that if I keep them on them on the edge of going out, I can handle them AND many layers of flavors present themselves that were otherwise overwhelmed by the "hot products," smoke volume, and the sheer strength of the nic kick.

Smoked normally, they plain sucked. But smoked with a long pause between draws and drawing so lightly as to almost let the smoked climb into your mouth by itself, they were nuanced, rich, and satisfying.

Wilkey

 

[KeyserSoze]

I have to agree for the most part. I noticed that the cigars from pepin smoke better when they're stored at a lower RH and when I pace myself. Flavors are noted much more so than if I were to rush it. The heat tends to overpower the taste to the point where it gets bitter. And in my experience, out of all the pepins I've smoked, I had about 2-5% that were either plugged, muted in flavors or burn issues. I'm not sure if it's my humidor at 57-64RH or just luck.

After just smoking a JJ maduro that was gifted to me, I also noticed the same thing. When I paced myself the flavors were much nicer and smoother.

 

[LilBastage]

This is a "secret" a lot of pipe smokers have been keen on for many years. If one just about lets his pipe go out, the tobacco rewards him with a wonderful burst of flavor on the next puff. I never really thought about it for cigars but I guess it makes sense.

Pipe tobacco also usually smokes better almost dried out as well. The steam generated from burning moister tobacco definitely masks the flavor in many cases.

 

[MadMonk]

Interesting point, Steve.

I've recently smoked some very strong cigars. So strong that I would normally not be able to handle them but I discovered that if I keep them on them on the edge of going out, I can handle them AND many layers of flavors present themselves that were otherwise overwhelmed by the "hot products," smoke volume, and the sheer strength of the nic kick.

Smoked normally, they plain sucked. But smoked with a long pause between draws and drawing so lightly as to almost let the smoked climb into your mouth by itself, they were nuanced, rich, and satisfying.

Wilkey

I've tried to convey this idea to a couple of BOTLs. This is what I call "sipping".

 

[Ginseng]

Interesting point, Steve.

I've recently smoked some very strong cigars. So strong that I would normally not be able to handle them but I discovered that if I keep them on them on the edge of going out, I can handle them AND many layers of flavors present themselves that were otherwise overwhelmed by the "hot products," smoke volume, and the sheer strength of the nic kick.

Smoked normally, they plain sucked. But smoked with a long pause between draws and drawing so lightly as to almost let the smoked climb into your mouth by itself, they were nuanced, rich, and satisfying.

Wilkey

I've tried to convey this idea to a couple of BOTLs. This is what I call "sipping".

Hey there, Dan.

I usually reserve sipping to mean light drawing but not necessarily on the edge of extinguishing. For example, really small gauge cigars such as Monte Joyitas and Rafael Gonzalez Cigarritos get sipped. They are already so well balanced and agreeable that I find no further benefit in letting the coal cool too much. Strong cigars, though, seem to require the full out assault. You can nose smoke Tat Brown, LFD Double Ligero Lancero, or young RyJ Cazadores this way. It's still a bit rough but otherwise impossible for me at least.

Wilkey

 

[MadMonk]

O.K., I see your good point. Now we have to come up with a new Cigar Pass term for this

 

[lordlister]

O.K., I see your good point. Now we have to come up with a new Cigar Pass term for this

I vote for slurping :thumbs:

 

[Doc Wylie]

I formerly was a locomotive smoker puffing away like all get-out and finding that the more full-bodied the cigar the worse it tasted to me. Once I figured out that slow meant less hot I finally started to enjoy them. I forced myself to set the cigar down between "sips" and found that they not only were no longer bitter and harsh, they were quite flavorful. I don't know about the lower rh factor but it certainly makes sense.

 

[Ginseng]

O.K., I see your good point. Now we have to come up with a new Cigar Pass term for this

How about "flatlining" or "snurping" or maybe "necro-huffing?"

Wilkey

 

[Seanholio]

O.K., I see your good point. Now we have to come up with a new Cigar Pass term for this

How about "flatlining" or "snurping" or maybe "necro-huffing?"

Wilkey

How about something along the lines of Life Support. ALS'ing or CTD'ing

 

[Macion Grey]

I am a self-confessed hot-boxer, as it brings out some great flavours in certain cigars. That is not to say that I don't 'tease' the smoke out as well, as that can suit certain types of cigars too. I keep them all at 65%RH, and experiment with each stick to see what treatment it deserves.

I find myself having to purge often when I hot-box the cigars that want to be abused. Pretty much every time the ash falls off (or sometimes when I help it fall) and halfway through, I 'super-purge' the stick with the lighter as well. It is very interesting to see all the tar buildup literally burn up in the heat of the lighter, dancing hotly in inch long flames.

I am actually a big fan of power-smoking a lot of strong blends, as I am also the sort that likes eating whole chillies as well. Strong is good for me. Of course, if you hotbox a Bolivar Gold Medal... you won't have a pleasant experience at all. Delicacy deserves appreciation.

 

[Ginseng]

Once I figured out that slow meant less hot I finally started to enjoy them. I forced myself to set the cigar down between "sips" and found that they not only were no longer bitter and harsh, they were quite flavorful.

I am a self-confessed hot-boxer, as it brings out some great flavours in certain cigars. That is not to say that I don't 'tease' the smoke out as well, as that can suit certain types of cigars too. I find myself having to purge often when I hot-box the cigars that want to be abused.

These two comments highlight something that I think is under appreciated with regard to the technique of cigar smoking. And that is that the pace and intensity of drawing can significantly affect what the cigar delivers in terms of flavor and also how the cigar performs in terms of smoking "cleanly."

When I used to do more intensive reviews, I would try to purposely vary the draw to see what sort of latitude of abuse a cigar could handle and also what range of flavors I could coax out of the cigar. I found that some cigars did not change much in essential character when puffed more vigorously. Others delivered a range of flavors that otherwise were not present or at least not detectable. And others, just got out of bed and got very nasty. I haven't made enough observations to try and correlate what construction or blend factors might affect how a cigar reacts to different draws, but it certainly suggests that to fully explore what a cigar is capable of offering, neither hotboxing nor sipping alone can do the job.

Wilkey

 

[Macion Grey]

These two comments highlight something that I think is under appreciated with regard to the technique of cigar smoking. And that is that the pace and intensity of drawing can significantly affect what the cigar delivers in terms of flavor and also how the cigar performs in terms of smoking "cleanly."

Absolutely. There is a lot that a cigar can offer if you take the time to explore it properly. The more you discover, the more you want to know. Unlocking a cigar's secrets can be rather rewarding.

 

[grateful1]

This is a "secret" a lot of pipe smokers have been keen on for many years. If one just about lets his pipe go out, the tobacco rewards him with a wonderful burst of flavor on the next puff. I never really thought about it for cigars but I guess it makes sense.

Pipe tobacco also usually smokes better almost dried out as well. The steam generated from burning moister tobacco definitely masks the flavor in many cases.

It's like anything else when watered down, it's not as tastey...

...well, almost anything else!

 

[Ginseng]

There is a lot that a cigar can offer if you take the time to explore it properly. The more you discover, the more you want to know. Unlocking a cigar's secrets can be rather rewarding.

Well said. :thumbs:

Honestly, sometimes I just want to puff and experience a burning tube of tobacco in its most basic and straightforward form. But when I am in the right frame of mind to explore, experiment, and tease, it's edifying to know that a cigar can be so much more than just a smoke tube. I guess that's why I love these buggers.

Wilkey

 

[vortex]

Interesting comments. The idea that the water content was related to the temp came to me from pipe smoking because of the "bite" you get from a too hot pack. Then I noticed the "nibbling" got easier and better. Then I had an "AHA" moment. This must apply to cigars in some fashion, too.


Term - nibbling to avoid a bite? Works for pipes but not cigars...

 

[Ginseng]

What is "nibbling?"

Doesn't pipe tobacco contain a higher moisture content to begin with? I imagine that with the flavorings and casings used, pipe tobaccos might tend to be more damp than tobacco in a cigar. Cigar tobacco has been oft quoted to have about 14% moisture by weight. What range might pipe tobacco span?

Wilkey

 

[grateful1]

What is "nibbling?"

Doesn't pipe tobacco contain a higher moisture content to begin with? I imagine that with the flavorings and casings used, pipe tobaccos might tend to be more damp than tobacco in a cigar. Cigar tobacco has been oft quoted to have about 14% moisture by weight. What range might pipe tobacco span?

Wilkey

This may have some info - linky.

 

[Ginseng]

Thanks Gary. Quite a useful link!

So 10-20% for pipe tobacco. That's a much broader range than for cigars.

Wilkey