Here puffy, puffy, puffy....here

[Rod]

I will have to agree that it's pretty sad that a very respected retailer who gave a lot to CP has left.

 

[wasy]

In the few dealings I've had with Al he is a stand up guy. As the thread progressed I wondered many times why the community seemed to side with a relatively new member here over a valued and trusted vendor.

 

[Ginseng]

How unfortunate.

This whole chain of events stank from the minute it was dragged over here from another forum.

Now not only is it unlikely we'll ever find out "the truth" but we've also lost an attentive and involved retailer.

Guys, this is not the way it's supposed to work.

Wilkey

 

[Zeebra]

I usually don't stick my nose into threads where Bill goes off on someone, because in most cases I don't know the person he's attacking. In this case I do. I've dealt with Al on numerous occasions and he's not only a great and considerate vendor, he's also a stand up guy. When Bill accused Al of trying to undermine Gabriel to take out his competition, I couldn't stand it any longer. Al has never tried to undermine another vendor, and especially not Gabriel. They have even run a contest together in the past, so accusing him of trying to suddenly undermine Gabriel's credibility comes across as what it is, ignorant and misinformed.

I don't know the original details of what transpired between Gabriel and Bob, because I wasn't there. Al, Bob and Gabriel know the full details. All I know is, Al is a great BOTL, a stand up vendor and a decent person. I'll defend him to the bitter end even if it means having to put up with Bill posting snide remarks in all my future threads.

 

[BobbyRitz]

How unfortunate.

This whole chain of events stank from the minute it was dragged over here from another forum.

Now not only is it unlikely we'll ever find out "the truth" but we've also lost an attentive and involved retailer.

Guys, this is not the way it's supposed to work.

Wilkey

No truer words spoken...err typed.

 

[theorangeman]

I agree that this was very unfortunate. Al is a very stand-up guy who made it very clear in his actions that he was here not just to push his wares but to contribute as a BOTL. Very few retailers can make that claim. I found it refreshing to have a guy like him here at CP and it's a shame if he is indeed gone for good.

 

[NullSmurf]

I will have to agree that it's pretty sad that a very respected retailer who gave a lot to CP has left.

x n

I sent Al a PM. If you want him to reconsider his decision, contact him.

 

[ggiese]

Yea one guy has to spoil this for everyone. Thanks!!!

And that guy would be... um... Puffy right? I mean, he decided he didn't like someone here, then further decided he didn't like someone here so much he didn't like anyone here. Exit stage left.

I think Puffy's a good guy but this is as wrong headed as it gets.

NA

What Neal says!!!

I believe most refer to it as, "throwing the baby out with the bath water..."

I've not dealt with Al, so I cannot speak to his credibility. I don't think anyone can argue he really was worked up over something that was truly senseless. It's one thing to defend friends - it's quite another to get to the point where you're foaming at the mouth and tossing chairs over a coupla comments. I don't care what was said. Geez - youda thunk ol' Bill had slept with Al and Bob's wives and turned them gay, or something!!!

And I'm also totally stunned that threads like that one get huge audiences! You look at the number views and I'm thinking someone's giving away Opus X Maddies!!!

Geez - it's just a bunch of characters on a computer screen, fer cripes sake. Y'all can't be that thin-skinned, can you??? If Bill really bugs you that much turn off the monitor, or don't look!!!

 

[centurycigar]

I agree with what some have posted. Al is a top-notch guy.
As a friend of his, Its hard to sit here and read some of the things that are being said.
Im posting to show Al my support as a customer and more importantly, a friend.
The shit stirring drama should be reserved for the "All My Children" forum ! (which Im a member..j/k)

 

[theorangeman]

If Bill really bugs you that much turn off the monitor, or don't look!!!

It's often difficult to do so, he seems to be everywhere. :whistling: By the way, I think Al did take your advice and has turned his monitor off (for good), at least from CP.

On another note... hey Rod, although gg has probably already contacted you regarding this, bring back the old winkie!

 

[CoventryCat86]

I usually don't stick my nose into threads where Bill goes off on someone, because in most cases I don't know the person he's attacking. In this case I do. I've dealt with Al on numerous occasions and he's not only a great and considerate vendor, he's also a stand up guy. When Bill accused Al of trying to undermine Gabriel to take out his competition, I couldn't stand it any longer. Al has never tried to undermine another vendor, and especially not Gabriel. They have even run a contest together in the past, so accusing him of trying to suddenly undermine Gabriel's credibility comes across as what it is, ignorant and misinformed.

I don't know the original details of what transpired between Gabriel and Bob, because I wasn't there. Al, Bob and Gabriel know the full details. All I know is, Al is a great BOTL, a stand up vendor and a decent person. I'll defend him to the bitter end even if it means having to put up with Bill posting snide remarks in all my future threads.

If you'd go back and look at the thread in question, I was questioning the inconsistencies in DISCDOG'S statements and out of absolutely nowhere puffstuff lays into me. The controversy was between discdog and gmiranda. I didn't "accuse" puffstuff of anything, his behavior caused me concern and I posted those concerns.

zebra, for you to imply that I just attacked puffstuff out of the middle of nowhere is completely irresponsible on your part and you should be ashamed of yourself. Your ignorant, misinformed and snide comments are not necessary here at all either.

SamClemmons also pointed out something that concerns me as well which is that discdog and puffstuff sure seem to have markedly different accounts of the same phone conversation.

 

[BrownDevil]

If Bill really bugs you that much turn off the monitor, or don't look!!!

It's often difficult to do so, he seems to be everywhere. :whistling: By the way, I think Al did take your advice and has turned his monitor off (for good), at least from CP.

On another note... hey Rod, although gg has probably already contacted you regarding this, bring back the old winkie!

Ditto, this winkie looks like he has gas

 

[bilder]

Yea one guy has to spoil this for everyone. Thanks!!!

And that guy would be... um... Puffy right? I mean, he decided he didn't like someone here, then further decided he didn't like someone here so much he didn't like anyone here. Exit stage left.

I think Puffy's a good guy but this is as wrong headed as it gets.

NA

What Neal says!!!

I believe most refer to it as, "throwing the baby out with the bath water..."

I've not dealt with Al, so I cannot speak to his credibility. I don't think anyone can argue he really was worked up over something that was truly senseless. It's one thing to defend friends - it's quite another to get to the point where you're foaming at the mouth and tossing chairs over a coupla comments. I don't care what was said. Geez - youda thunk ol' Bill had slept with Al and Bob's wives and turned them gay, or something!!!

And I'm also totally stunned that threads like that one get huge audiences! You look at the number views and I'm thinking someone's giving away Opus X Maddies!!!

Geez - it's just a bunch of characters on a computer screen, fer cripes sake. Y'all can't be that thin-skinned, can you??? If Bill really bugs you that much turn off the monitor, or don't look!!!

I think the heart of the issue is the warpath Bill has been on lately. He has chased off a number of guys, some had it coming, others were just making newb mistakes and he jumped on them for it. It gets real old real fast to see a forum cop turn into a vigilante. Bill has been banned from other cigar forums, would be a shame to see it happen here, but if he starts to cost Rod sponsors.....

Bill is on my ignore list for that reason. I am tired of his drama, so I choose not to read it any longer. I just feel sorry for the next newb that crosses his path.

 

[CoventryCat86]

I think the heart of the issue is the warpath Bill has been on lately. He has chased off a number of guys, some had it coming, others were just making newb mistakes and he jumped on them for it. It gets real old real fast to see a forum cop turn into a vigilante. Bill has been banned from other cigar forums, would be a shame to see it happen here, but if he starts to cost Rod sponsors.....

Bill is on my ignore list for that reason. I am tired of his drama, so I choose not to read it any longer. I just feel sorry for the next newb that crosses his path.

Your version of the facts are quite amusing. I'd be very interested in who you think made "newb mistakes" that I "jumped on them for it." Honestly bilder, I'd like to know because I don't know what you're talking about.

 

[Rod]

zebra, for you to imply that I just attacked puffstuff out of the middle of nowhere is completely irresponsible on your part and you should be ashamed of yourself. Your ignorant, misinformed and snide comments are not necessary here at all either.

Bill,

When are you going to get it? Knock it off, it's gotten old. You're slamming respected members for the EXACT things that YOU do. I highly suggest you rethink your posts before hitting submit from here on out. I'm receiving far too much email from respected members who are all getting tired of reading posts like this from you.

Again, I highly recommend you heed my advice.

Rod

 

[puffstuff]

Guys, I would like to try and clean up my side of the street as best I can here. I know what I heard. I'm not saying who is wrong or right in the situation between Bob and Gabe. I do know Gabe cleaned up his side of the street as best he could. This was never an attack on him. I am quite certain there was some sort of communication break down during the transaction. The transaction is not what I had a problem with, It was Bill, calling my friend a liar. That was completely uncalled for. I'm not going to attack you here Bill, but those were some pretty strong words. If you and I became friends, my response to someone attacking you would be exactly the same as I defended Bob. I was not "foaming at the mouth" I was defending my friend who is one of the nicest most stand up guys you would ever want to meet and didn't want to continue to be attacked every time he posted here. So he was going to let it go. George, I thought you might have a better understanding of why I handled things the way I did. I grew up around 26th and Kedzie on Chicago's west side, I have had 2 family members murdered in that neighborhood and also numerous friends. In my neighborhood, If you didn't have your friends back it could very well mean he might not make it through the night. My family and my friends are the 2 most important things to me in life. If you screw around with either one of them, you better believe I'm going to respond. I'm here because I enjoy it, I don't give a shit about making a whole pile of money. If I did, I would go back to my job before I did this ( A ship Captain) where I made 7 times what I make now.
I'm here to hang out with some guys that have one of the same loves as I do, CIGARS!!!!! Bill, if I came off threatening, I sincerely apologize, that was not my intent.
Thanks guys for all your support, the phone calls are what most surprised me. I truly have made some great friends here and would love to continue to make more, but if the environment stays the it's been around here, it would be very difficult. I was trying to make a point with my post and I think it was made. We are here for our love of cigars, when that is no longer the focus, I have no reason to be here.

Al

 

[NullSmurf]

That discdog and puffstuff sure seem to have markedly different accounts of the same phone conversation bothers me too, Bill. Whose is accurate? Either of them? I think both Bob and Al both heard what they wanted to hear. How did you come to conclude that discdog was lying?

Al did come out of nowhere, but you accused one of his best friends of being a liar - pretty strong stuff. I don't think you realize that. If accused me to MY face, one of us would be getting beat up. If you accused my best friend, the result would be the same.

I think that accusing Al of undermining Gabriel in order to gain a compeitive advantage to be the ultimate low blow. That was pure hurtful speculation. You may as well have said, "yeah, well I'm rubber and you're glue". You are entitled to your opinion, but do you honestly think that?

I have reason to like Al. You stepped in and stirred the shit AFTER everthing was resolved. Do I blame you for running Al off? It seems like there are a few around who do. Me, I'm having a hard time with that it. This was Al's decision and I think it was a bit juvenile, but expect he won't change his mind. I don't suppose you'd consider an apology to Bob, would you?

Edit: shitty font

 

[Ginseng]

Guys, I would like to try and clean up my side of the street as best I can here. I know what I heard. I'm not saying who is wrong or right in the situation between Bob and Gabe. I do know Gabe cleaned up his side of the street as best he could. This was never an attack on him. I am quite certain there was some sort of communication break down during the transaction. The transaction is not what I had a problem with, It was Bill, calling my friend a liar. That was completely uncalled for. I'm not going to attack you here Bill, but those were some pretty strong words. If you and I became friends, my response to someone attacking you would be exactly the same as I defended Bob. I was not "foaming at the mouth" I was defending my friend who is one of the nicest most stand up guys you would ever want to meet and didn't want to continue to be attacked every time he posted here. So he was going to let it go. George, I thought you might have a better understanding of why I handled things the way I did. I grew up around 26th and Kedzie on Chicago's west side (maybe you know the area), I have had 2 family members murdered in that neighborhood and also numerous friends. In my neighborhood, If you didn't have your friends back it could very well mean he might not make it through the night. My family and my friends are the 2 most important things to me in life. If you screw around with either one of them, you better believe I'm going to respond. I'm here because I enjoy it, I don't give a shit about making a whole pile of money. If I did, I would go back to my job before I did this ( A ship Captain) where I made 7 times what I make now.
I'm here to hang out with some guys that have one of the same loves as I do, CIGARS!!!!! Bill, if I came off threatening, I sincerely apologize, that was not my intent.
Thanks guys for all your support, the phone calls are what most surprised me. I truly have made some great friends here and would love to continue to make more, but if the environment stays the it's been around here, it would be very difficult. I was trying to make a point with my post and I think it was made. We are here for our love of cigars, when that is no longer the focus, I have no reason to be here.

Al

What Bruce said.

With all due respect, Al. This is not the street. Listen, I've lived in Harlem. I survived PS in the city. I have an idea what the street is like. But this is not the street. This community needs civility and tolerance to function. Taking the high road has never been the wrong move here. Being the bigger man has never led to loss of respect.

The fact that disrespecting someone here won't get you knifed or shot suggests to me that it is not a life or death situation. As a result, it is safe to moderate our instinctive responses. Think, type, think, type, step away, then maybe hit the post button.

I hope you won't let your frustrations with one or two members prevent you from servicing and delighting the many members here who appreciate your support and your friendship.

Wilkey

 

[NullSmurf]

What Wilkey said goes for me too, Al. Please reconsider. You're much more than a favored vendor.

 

[CoventryCat86]

That discdog and puffstuff sure seem to have markedly different accounts of the same phone conversation bothers me too, Bill. Whose is accurate? Either of them? I think both Bob and Al both heard what they wanted to hear. How did you come to conclude that discdog was lying?

Al did come out of nowhere, but you accused one of his best friends of being a liar - pretty strong stuff. I don't think you realize that. If accused me to MY face, one of us would be getting beat up. If you accused my best friend, the result would be the same.

I think that accusing Al of undermining Gabriel in order to gain a compeitive advantage to be the ultimate low blow. That was pure hurtful speculation. You may as well have said, "yeah, well I'm rubber and you're glue". You are entitled to your opinion, but do you honestly think that?

I have reason to like Al. You stepped in and stirred the shit AFTER everthing was resolved. Do I blame you for running Al off? It seems like there are a few around who do. Me, I'm having a hard time with that it. This was Al's decision and I think it was a bit juvenile, but expect he won't change his mind. I don't suppose you'd consider an apology to Bob, would you?

You've got a couple of details slightly wrong here nullsmurf, puffstuff came out of nowhere before I ever used the word "liar" and once again, I did not "accuse" him or "undermining Gabriel" I asked him a question because his posts and actions led me to ask the question. Okay so you say it was "pure hurtful speculation" well can you understand that I might have been just a little dumbfounded with him after such statements as:

One thing I will tell you for certain is, that you would never say anything like you did here, to Bob's face. Because he would probably break every bone in your body.

I don't know how it is where you live, but if you call a man a liar where we live there's going to be a fight.

You weren't around when barney made similar comments directed at Lee but he was banned for that and I find the fact that puffstuff was given a complete pass on that to be troubling. He just now apologized for that so it's water under the bridge at this point.

As far as my "apology" to discdog, I'm sorry I used some strong words but I still have a great deal of concern with the three versions of the story about what's going on here between he and gmiranda33 and those who claim I was "defending" gmiranda. My concern is that there are three vastly different versions of what happened here and those who equate my concern with "defending" are wrong headed.

Rod, I thought you locked the Torano Noventa thread with this comment:

Keep this bullshit at the "cesspool" where it belongs, please.

so why is the discussion still continuing here?