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The Empire Strikes Back...the pass

I saw this truck the other day and figured I'd share it with you all.

05-06-09_1239.jpg




*****



bully1875 said:
T: 7 - Anejo Shark - $9.25 ----------------------------> Cabaiguan Guapo Maduro - $9.50 - GOOD
18 - GoF Carlito Double Robusto $20 -----> Casa Fuente Pyramid #2 - $26 - GOOD
40 - Opus X El Escorpion $45 ---------------> DAGA Sun Grown - $60 - GOOD
55 - Tatuaje Frank $13 ----------------------> Padilla 32 Oscuro LE Torpedo - $29 - GOOD
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I'm not sure how I feel about this so I may be spitting into the wind just to see what happens, but it sort of jumps out at me how much more all the puts are listed for compared to their respective takes.

I realize that depending on perspective (and I suppose relative position in the pass) this could be a good thing or it could be a bad thing, but when you discount the $0.25 from the Shark-->Guapo Maduro swap, there are three puts that overshoot their takes by $37--an average of over $12 per stick.

This is only my fourth pass, and I imagine that this issue has come up before in the past (I didn't search at all, and I feel that since each pass is its own creature, any results would have only advisory at best anyway), but I just wanted to bring it to light to see what everyone thought about it.
 
The Green Monkey said:
bully1875 said:
T: 7 - Anejo Shark - $9.25 ----------------------------> Cabaiguan Guapo Maduro - $9.50 - GOOD
18 - GoF Carlito Double Robusto $20 -----> Casa Fuente Pyramid #2 - $26 - GOOD
40 - Opus X El Escorpion $45 ---------------> DAGA Sun Grown - $60 - GOOD
55 - Tatuaje Frank $13 ----------------------> Padilla 32 Oscuro LE Torpedo - $29 - GOOD
Click to expand...

I'm not sure how I feel about this so I may be spitting into the wind just to see what happens, but it sort of jumps out at me how much more all the puts are listed for compared to their respective takes.

I realize that depending on perspective (and I suppose relative position in the pass) this could be a good thing or it could be a bad thing, but when you discount the $0.25 from the Shark-->Guapo Maduro swap, there are three puts that overshoot their takes by $37--an average of over $12 per stick.

This is only my fourth pass, and I imagine that this issue has come up before in the past (I didn't search at all, and I feel that since each pass is its own creature, any results would have only advisory at best anyway), but I just wanted to bring it to light to see what everyone thought about it.
Click to expand...

I am with you to an extent. The first and second t/p are fine. The third one is a bit exaggerated, but Jeff is a generous BOTL. Also there are not many $45 sticks around, and the DAGA is a fair put IMHO. The fourth one is extremely generous, but I am not sure if the $29 is the current value for it. I do not follow Padilla like I follow Tatuaje or Opus.

I do agree that it can hurt the pass by pushing some people out of their price range, but with the nature of the sticks in this pass I can see it being part of the territory. IMHO it is fine, but what do I know :laugh:
 
Glad this was brought up.. I see this as an act of generosity, however as Ed brought up I see how it can push people away.. The rarity for the Frank and Padilla are not very well matched (from my research the Padilla can still be bought, pretty easy if you google it), but the price tag I feel make's up for the rarity. I may be barking up the wrong branch here, but the Padilla is in fact a rare treat, but I'm not sure there are too many smokes out there that are in the $13 range the were limited to 666 boxes at 13 sticks per box. Even some of the HTF Opus have more quantities released than that.

I would like to see more discussion about this, but as of now they still all look like good P/T's..

And yes, I was mistaken on the El Escorpion MSRP..
 
Jonesy said:
Gonz said:
What's a DAGA Sun Grown?
Click to expand...
Don Arturo Gran AniverXario
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Yes

bfreebern said:
Gonz said:
What's a DAGA Sun Grown?
Click to expand...

I'm thinking it's the Don Arturo Gran AniverXario.
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Correct

insight said:
Gonz said:
What's a DAGA Sun Grown?
Click to expand...

Don Arturo Gran Arnsidnirnivnaerxairo Sun Grown. The AF13 rebanded
Click to expand...

Yes

Gonz said:
What's a DAGA Sun Grown?
Click to expand...

Hope that helps :)
 
Oh, ok. Funny, I was contemplating one of those as a put for that El Escorpion, but I figured it was about $20 more of a cigar, and just a little out of control.

Very nice put there! :thumbs:
 
Gonz said:
Oh, ok. Funny, I was contemplating one of those as a put for that El Escorpion, but I figured it was about $20 more of a cigar, and just a little out of control.

Very nice put there! :thumbs:
Click to expand...

By all mean's I will allow it :)
 
If anyone is offended by the overput, I can adjust my trades.

My feelings is that I really want that El Escorpion. I have the maduro version, and I want the rosado to match it. There's not to many sticks out there that compete with $/rarity of that stick - the DAGA is the first that came to mind. I was thinking a Forbidden banded BBMF, but that seemed not rare enough and too much $.

On the Frank, I was somewhat perplexed on what to put. It's a rare stick @ $13. Not necessarily rare "right now" so to speak, but the production run was very limited. That leaves only a few sticks in recent memory that live up to its cost/rarity. IMO, something like an Opus is very short in the rarity department. If the Padilla 32 Oscuro is considered heavy on the $ and it offends anyone at all, I could swap it up to something like an LG Small Batch No. 2. They're not quite as rare as the Franks, but they're about $3 bucks more. I don't think you see LG Small batch floating around much, but I could be mistaken.

The other stick that was "calling my name" was the LFD Salomon. Hypothetically, if the big price jump offends anyone, I could swap out the Padilla 32 Oscuro for this stick, and re-work the Frank trade as I mentioned.

Just let me know :thumbs:!

Edit: I currently know of no place where you can still buy the Padilla 32 Oscuro without buying a whole humidor. I'll dig up the quote from Ernesto somewhere. On some forum he commented about their production numbers. I'll have to search for it.
 
If the price of the Padilla is an issue, I'd think the LG Small Batch #2 would be more in line. They are getting pretty hard to find. I only know of one vendor who has a box available, and singles are pretty much sold out. I did come across one vendor (don't remember who) about a month ago that were selling them I think for $19 :angry: . Granted the rarity isn't the same as the Franks, but they are increasingly getting rarer. (btw if anyone knows where singles can be had please let me know - I've been looking for a couple of months now.)
 
jlada said:
If anyone is offended by the overput, I can adjust my trades.

My feelings is that I really want that El Escorpion. I have the maduro version, and I want the rosado to match it. There's not to many sticks out there that compete with $/rarity of that stick - the DAGA is the first that came to mind. I was thinking a Forbidden banded BBMF, but that seemed not rare enough and too much $.

On the Frank, I was somewhat perplexed on what to put. It's a rare stick @ $13. Not necessarily rare "right now" so to speak, but the production run was very limited. That leaves only a few sticks in recent memory that live up to its cost/rarity. IMO, something like an Opus is very short in the rarity department. If the Padilla 32 Oscuro is considered heavy on the $ and it offends anyone at all, I could swap it up to something like an LG Small Batch No. 2. They're not quite as rare as the Franks, but they're about $3 bucks more. I don't think you see LG Small batch floating around much, but I could be mistaken.

The other stick that was "calling my name" was the LFD Salomon. Hypothetically, if the big price jump offends anyone, I could swap out the Padilla 32 Oscuro for this stick, and re-work the Frank trade as I mentioned.

Just let me know :thumbs: !

Edit: I currently know of no place where you can still buy the Padilla 32 Oscuro without buying a whole humidor. I'll dig up the quote from Ernesto somewhere. On some forum he commented about their production numbers. I'll have to search for it.
Click to expand...

I'm pretty sure no one will take offense to it.. The LG Small Batch # 2 is a very nice put, but for the Frank I'm not sure you meet the rarity on it.. I have 2 B&M's that I can walk into today (not to mention online sources that have them in stock) and get them. But at this point your approved with what you previously wanted. The LFD Salomon is a great smoke and if you want it, you should go for it.
 
By no means have I been offended by any of this--I simply wanted to tease out the issue a little.

After a bit more thought, I guess my main concern was with the precedent it sets. Not in the sense that we'll all suddenly feel obligated to nearly double up the prices of our takes, but rather that totally blowing your takes out of the water on three of your four exchanges is so unremarkable, pedestrian, and perfectly typical that it is not at all worthy of any discussion or debate.

I know that the peculiarities which made for difficult matching on the desired sticks is at the root of all this, so I acknowledge that while unlikely (and probably compounded by the fact that I'm still new to the game), it would be really frustrating for me if I were the last person to receive the pass and all I had to take from were $40/$50/$60+ cigars.
 
The Green Monkey said:
By no means have I been offended by any of this--I simply wanted to tease out the issue a little.

After a bit more thought, I guess my main concern was with the precedent it sets. Not in the sense that we'll all suddenly feel obligated to nearly double up the prices of our takes, but rather that totally blowing your takes out of the water on three of your four exchanges is so unremarkable, pedestrian, and perfectly typical that it is not at all worthy of any discussion or debate.

I know that the peculiarities which made for difficult matching on the desired sticks is at the root of all this, so I acknowledge that while unlikely (and probably compounded by the fact that I'm still new to the game), it would be really frustrating for me if I were the last person to receive the pass and all I had to take from were $40/$50/$60+ cigars.
Click to expand...

I assure you, this pass will never hit the point to where the only sticks left were $40/$50/$60+ cigars. I like the way this is turning out, because it give's the opportunity for some folks to trade up to something they have never had. I also allow CC for NC for the same reason, this way if you have some super nice NC's you want to trade for CC's everyone get's to try them.. I realize it is frowned upon quite a bit, but it seem's to have been working for us so far..

Gonz said:
It's too bad this has never been discussed before :rolleyes:
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All part of the learning curve. But at least for the most part we were able to come to an understanding.
 
Doesn't anyone recall that thread recently where Anthony got called out for being overly generous with his puts? :sign:
 
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