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The color of ash

I

Ivanovich

Will Design for Leaf
Joined
Jan 24, 2006
Messages
146
I've been batting this around in my noggin' for a couple days now.

What determines the color of ash?

I smoked a couple Padron 3000s last week and the ash was spectacularly bright. I'd never smoked anything with such white ash. So far, I've noticed that when smoking, the brighter or more uniform in color the ash is, I feel a notion of aesthetic 'purity'. I suppose that's kind of the idea. I also smoked half the stick before being concerned it would fall on it's own. It was strong and probably would have lasted another inch. I ended up ashing only the once and let the rest hang on right down to the nub. Are the qualities of ash color and (structural) stength related?

I had a 2000 last night. The ash was a dark gray and had a kind of leopard print pattern of varying tones of gray. Why would two sticks so closely related in the same line from a single brand have such variation?

Is ash color an idicator of any level of quality of the tobacco that can also affect the taste or aroma?

Does aging (in the humi) affect the ash color?

If anyone has any suggestions of other sticks I can try which are known to have a bright, strong ash I'd sure appreciate it.
 
If you do a search on cigar ash you can see that this same topic came up in October 2005. This is what N2adventure said and I have read this more then once.

The color of the ash is determined by the amount of various minerals in the soil - which I guess would effect the taste.
:cool:
 
lol thought this topic sounded familiar :sign:
 
tasman said:
The color of the ash is determined by the amount of various minerals in the soil - which I guess would effect the taste.
:cool:
Click to expand...

I don't necessarily agree with this line of thinking. Just based on knowledge of chemistry, it would seem that the amount of minerals that would need to be present just couldn't be present. I actually think it has more to do with the combustion (complete versus incomplete) which can be impacted by the moisture content, age of the cigar, type of tobacco used, and some other factors.
 
D'oh. I guess I shoulda expected this to have been brought up before. Thanks for directing me.
 
cigardawg said:
tasman said:
The color of the ash is determined by the amount of various minerals in the soil - which I guess would effect the taste.
:cool:
Click to expand...

I don't necessarily agree with this line of thinking. Just based on knowledge of chemistry, it would seem that the amount of minerals that would need to be present just couldn't be present. I actually think it has more to do with the combustion (complete versus incomplete) which can be impacted by the moisture content, age of the cigar, type of tobacco used, and some other factors.
Click to expand...



Ingredients are added to the soil. So, I was told by a B & M.



CF also has an aticle referencing 'magnesium' as the culprit.

A better article is this. <----more detail regarding the actual plant/process.

Excerpt:

"In finished cigars, calcium is responsible for producing light, tight ash. Dark gray, broken and flaky ash shows calcium deficiency. Likewise, the cigar's ability to hold an ash without dropping is a function of calcium balance."

". Magnesium is also important in the combustion of tobacco. A black ash indicates incomplete combustion of the carbon in the leaf, and is a sign of insufficient magnesium. We mentioned calcium's role in creating white, solid ash; magnesium can be substituted for calcium with the same desirable result, if other chemicals are in correct balance. Magnesium-deficient plants can cause some cracking and premature dropping of the ash, depending on the balance of other elements in tobacco's diet."
 
I dunno but its kinda cool smokeing a Mayorga and getting the yellow ash.
 
Apathy78 said:
Here you go!
Click to expand...
I thought I remembered this topic too, and I do remember reading MNR's attempt at an explanation. I also thought I remembered Ginsing going into great detail about it, but had a tough time finding it. However, here is a snippet that is releveant.

Ginseng said:
3. If you see stripes or ridges of alternating dark and light bands that cut across the ash, this is most likely due to changes in combustion conditions. Such as a quicker or slower draw.

The ash color, in general, is determined by two conditions both of which are mentioned by bmickey. These are trace mineral content AND combustion condition. From the field of analytical chemistry (with which I've had experience over the years as and engineer) ash color is considered to be a clue to mineral content. The reason being that if combustion is complete, all that should be produced is heat, water and carbon dioxide leaving any remaining minerals and metals which do not burn. The test I've performed is called "ash content."

Combustion conditions are also important because not only the rate of burn but the availability of sufficient oxygen for complete combustion determines the extent to which this is achieved. If you have a torch lighter, try dabbing the unburnt wrapper as well as the ash with the flame and you can see the affect additional or modified combustion conditions can have on ash color.

I hope that helps more than it confuses.

Wilkey
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My $.02 for what its worth, I do think that the age of the cigar affects the ash color, mainly because the chemicals among all the leaves meld together more fully the longer a cigar sits. It seems that an aged cigar combusts more efficiently than younger cigars, and therefore would affect the color of the ash.

But honestly, I just look at it with mild curiosity these days and focus much more on the flavor and enjoyable experience of smoking the cigar.

Cheers,
- C
 
tasman said:
The color of the ash is determined by the amount of various minerals in the soil - which I guess would effect the taste.
:cool:
Click to expand...

No matter the color or the minerals, I've never enjoyed the taste of ash.

But maybe I'm smokin the wrong 'gars ???
 
cigardawg said:
...I actually think it has more to do with the combustion (complete versus incomplete) which can be impacted by the moisture content, age of the cigar, type of tobacco used, and some other factors.
Click to expand...

I would definitely agree with this statement if the combustion level for cigar tobacco wasn't so low. I have a friend who is a mining engineer who I've discussed this with in regards to the combustion of coal and it's ash color which is determined by incomplete combustion. But cigar tobacco combusts so thoroughly that I think this is not the case for determining ash color.

I did some more "searching" last night and found this to be interesting:

Soil is rich with chemical compounds and a variety of mineral deposits, which are carried into plants by moisture. The soil in different regions is distinguished by its own characteristics: different minerals predominate in different places. Hence the same plant will have essentially different chemical and mineral contents in different areas. For instance, cigars rolled from tobacco grown in the central regions of Cuba (Remedios) produce almost white ash; cigars made of tobacco from the Vuelta Abajo produce gray ash with white veins. Take into consideration that the two areas are adjacent to each other. The difference takes place because the soil in the Vuelta Abajo is full of various minerals in roughly equal amounts, while the soil in the Remedios Region is characterized by potassium predomination.

The connection between the chemical contents of the soil and the quality of the cigar made of tobacco grown in it has been scientifically proved. Moreover, in early 2001 one of the scientists from a Canadian consumer organization proposed to make tests on the chemical components in order to protect genuine Cuban cigars from fakes. His idea was that cigars labeled as Cuban, but whose chemical contents proved to be different from the chemical contents of the appropriate region of Cuba, should be removed from the shops right away.

Thus the predominance of gray and white in the cigar ash testifies that it is of good quality. Pure white ash may be considered as a mark of quality, proving that the cigar is from certain places like Cuba or the Dominican Republic, where there are plantations that are particularly full of potassium. Black ash is a bad sign. Leaves that after burning produce black ash are poor in minerals and produce a very unpleasant taste and smell.
Click to expand...

Hope this helps.

~Mark

.
 
marcsheldon said:
where's wilkey when you need him....?
Click to expand...

Marc,

I saw this thread but had to psych myself up for it. :D

I tend to agree with Cigardawg on this one. An analytical chemist I spoke with (he frequents another board) feels that the combustion conditions are at least as important as the mineral content in determining the shade of the ash. The reasons I believe this to be so is as follows:

1. You can alter the color of the ash by using a torch flame lighter. Try it some time. If you apply the hot tip of the torch to a grey ash, you will eventually turn it bright white. A regular flame lighter is not alway able to do this. This is the result of the high temperatures consuming any incomplete combustion products as well as burning off organics, which may be dark colored.

2. The mineral content is relevant in analytical chemistry per the "ash test." You typically burn the material to be tested at very high tempreatures such that all that can possibly remain are the minerals. All organic compounds are burnt off. These temperatures are well beyond what you find in cigar combustion (which is actually more of a slow smolder.) The color of what remains is purely the mineral content.

Some have opined that cigar ash gets whiter the longer you age a cigar. After 20 or 30 years, the ash gets bright white. I tend not to put much stock into this hypothesis. However, it does make some sense if one agrees that in the process of aging the long-chain and poor burning compounds are converted into smaller, free burning chemicals. I have not sought out the research that might shed light on this aspect of combustion.

Thus far, I have found no compelling evidence that ash color is correlated to "quality" in any direct or indirect way.

Wilkey
 
These responses have been way more fascinating than I was expecting. Thanks all for the input. I think my brain is full for the day now.
 
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